FOXPRO's Jon Collins and MFK's Torry Cook discuss every you need to know to start shotgunning coyotes.
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welcome to the fox Pro podcast brought
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to you by Fox Pro game calls we're
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rolling again with another episode of
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the fox Pro podcast I'm John Collins and
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we're joined by Tory cook of mfk game
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calls today we'll be discussing using
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shotguns for predator hunting now Tori
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have you ever packed a shotgun on a
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predator
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stand a couple
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times got a little a little comfortable
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with a shotgun over the years yeah I
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think you got a little bit of experience
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you know you're you've probably packed a
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shotgun more and more consistently than
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anybody I've ever hunted with so you're
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the perfect guest for this podcast right
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here covering shotguns for predator
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hunting and we can kind of wrap all this
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in there you know kyot calling uh
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raccoon calling Bobcats whatever will
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come to a to a fox Pro uh you know you
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can hunt with a shotgun pretty much
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so yeah so what you been into lately you
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doing all
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right oh yeah it's uh it's hot down here
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in Arkansas I've been doing a fair
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amount of [ __ ] calling I'm just now
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getting ready to crank up should have
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went this morning didn't do it I'm just
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now getting ready to uh start thumping
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the coach pretty heavy the last couple
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years I've held off I usually hunt them
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in years past of HED them all summer
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yeah but the last couple of years I've
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kind of held off been doing a lot of
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self and stuff so I've held off until
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that family bust up time frame starts
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which is creeping up you know some of
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some of the coats are already starting
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to separate a little bit get a little
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distance in them and I figured out that
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that really helps me for one I like that
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time of the year you get to call in a
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lot of Cs on one stand a lot of times y
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helps me with the self filming and you
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know the C pups are bigger so it just
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opens up you know you got a lot more CS
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to call right this time of year so I
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will work on them pretty heavy starting
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probably in the morning and go just
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about every day until bow season starts
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so nice nice yeah bow season's creeping
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up on us too yeah I'm I'm kind of pumped
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for that I got me a brand new bow I
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hadn't shot it yet think about shooting
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it this evening once it cools off out
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here a little bit but I tell you what I
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am a little jealous of you being able to
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call raccoons at this at this point in
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time here in my state we can't call them
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till October 1st and I've seen you and
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Cory gr and a few other guys Absolut
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Jimmy white down in Tennessee absolutely
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thumping them yeah I know I've had a few
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messages about the [ __ ] calling uh with
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bows shotguns the whole deal just [ __ ]
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calling in general and I I've seen where
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a lot of people we used to have a season
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on them and now we don't but that
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cripples I say cripples that hinders the
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[ __ ] calling a little bit because it
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causes you to miss that prime time time
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kind of like the coats where the coons
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are in that P rearing yep stage and that
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is when I mean you see from all the
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people you just mentioned their post and
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how aggressive the coons are that's the
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prime time so that October you know if
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your season opens a little bit later you
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can still call Coons it just you know
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you you don't get in that prime time of
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calling so you kind of miss that you
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know family bust up for the coons is
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taking place too so you're not getting
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in on that real aggressive those stons
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charging the
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call y'all have had me fired up I've
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actually contemplated now the guys
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listening to this and gals are probably
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going to think this sounds crazy but I
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have actually contemplated traveling to
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go raccoon Colin I've thought about
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holling at you or Jimmy or Mark Larice
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he's down in Tennessee somewhere I can
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go to get in on some of this crazy
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action cuz man it's it's fastpaced and
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it's when you really get in them and get
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into some good country you about call
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them up on every stand this time of year
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won't you you know if you're getting
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getting a groove of it if you time it
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right it's uh it can be to where it's
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I've had a couple of days this you know
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just here recently where uh I call up a
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[ __ ] and sometimes multiple Coons on
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every stand and you're talking about
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typically five minute stands you're not
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sitting out there for 15 20 minutes like
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you do on a go stand longer you're just
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rolling right through them don't have to
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move very far and it is if people
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haven't you know had tried [ __ ] calling
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experienced how aggressive they are
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that's something they definitely need to
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try and June typically June through
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August is that's your Prime [ __ ] calling
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time frame and then you have another one
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in wintertime and that's when your
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Coon's rut and the difference is you'll
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call up almost all s cones you'll have a
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few other cones coming in and sometimes
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you'll call the whole family group the
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last [ __ ] stand I made I think I called
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I'm trying to there was five of them and
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it was the whole family group The that s
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[ __ ] and all the [ __ ] kittens which ad
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done got up pretty good size you know
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they were half her size they all came to
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the call right and in the winter time
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during that [ __ ] rut just about every
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[ __ ] you call is gonna be a big Bor [ __ ]
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so it's there's two times of the year
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and you just have to right find those
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two times for the area you're in and you
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can all up Coons on just about every
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stand and outside of that outside of
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that it's more
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like a lot of your C calling where
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you're making stands and some days
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you're killing them some days you're not
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have blank stands in there and a lot of
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times with the coons outside those time
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frames you may have several blank stands
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so right yeah that's that unfortunately
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that's the time frame I've got besides
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for the rut but you know hey I take what
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I can get but we're going to try to of
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course you know when it comes to Raccoon
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calling one of the popular things to use
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is a shotgun now Tor He he'll use a
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stick bow he'll use anything to kill him
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with them you know kill with kill the
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racco but we're going to keep this to
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shotgun hunting and this is going to be
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pretty cold heavy and we might talk
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about bobcats and fox and other things
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but you know shot shotgun and coyot and
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other Predators is you know it's
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definitely nothing I wouldn't call it
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new it's nothing new but running a
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shotgun for coyotes other Predators has
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been around since the invention of
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shotguns and the concept of Predator
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coling but um I guess you could say Tory
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the game has definitely changed over the
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years especially when we talk about the
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advancements of of equipment like choke
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tubes uh better shot it's available out
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there today like
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TSS and stuff like that but what I
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wanted to start off with here uh just
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kind of talk about the experiences you
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had uh how long have you personally been
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running a shotgun when it comes to
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predator
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hunting I don't even remember exactly
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when I started it was my early teenage
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years and I went to a shotgun really
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quick I started out like I said I was a
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kid so I started out with a 22 mag and I
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figured out pretty quick after I watched
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a couple of them run off that a 22 mag
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was not ideal for coats or Bob and we
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were already you know I was kind of for
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fored into the shotgun deal I'd always
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hunted one you know small game squirrels
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all that kind of stuff so I was
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comfortable with a shotgun more than a
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rifle and uh it's so thick down here
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even shooting that stuff with a 22 mag
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or had I been toen 22250 or you know any
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of the bigger rifles I was still gonna
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have shots inside shotgun range so it
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was just a natural move to pick up a
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shot and start predator hunting with a
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shotgun that was you know a lot better
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than the 22 magnum and my shots were
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always close due to how thick the Trin
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was so I would say that I started you
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know in
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that probably first experiences were in
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that I don't know 12 13 14 early teenage
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years so so practically the bulk of your
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hunting career your hunting life has
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been packing a shotgun for for these
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things and you know it's pretty
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interesting and I I you know I kind of
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smiled a little bit when you started
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talking comparing to like a 22 22 maget
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type of stuff and and my seminars I do
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when I wrap it up towards the end the
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last thing I talk about is caliber
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choices um for Cs and other Critters
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whatever they want to ask about but
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there's a section there where I say you
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know stay away from the rim fires and
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then I have a section about shotguns I
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tell them you know hey your shotguns
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with a proper shot is a lot more lethal
0:08:58.240,0:09:02.720
than a Rimfire I is so I I kind of kind
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of perked up there when you said you
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know I figured out that my 12 gauge was
0:09:04.360,0:09:08.800
a lot more potent than my 22
0:09:06.440,0:09:11.720
magnum yeah yeah for sure and you
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mentioned it a while ago now that TSS is
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available I mean that's Game Changer
0:09:14.320,0:09:19.920
huge difference you know when you're
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making a if you compared years ago
0:09:19.920,0:09:23.279
people might argue with you a little bit
0:09:21.560,0:09:25.360
but now there is no argument I mean if
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you've got a if you've got your shotgun
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dialed in you've got a 100 yard gun with
0:09:27.760,0:09:32.720
the shotgun and that 22 Magnum it ain't
0:09:30.640,0:09:34.800
going to touch a I mean it don't even
0:09:32.720,0:09:36.240
compare like I say with the shotgun you
0:09:34.800,0:09:37.680
shoot him in the tail knock his teeth
0:09:36.240,0:09:39.480
out and you still got him you shoot him
0:09:37.680,0:09:41.720
in the tail that 22 magnum he's just
0:09:39.480,0:09:43.320
gonna catch another gear well let's
0:09:41.720,0:09:44.800
let's actually talk about that a little
0:09:43.320,0:09:47.880
bit because that is one of the questions
0:09:44.800,0:09:51.600
I had for you Tori um and that is what
0:09:47.880,0:09:54.320
is the effective range of TSS in your
0:09:51.600,0:09:57.959
shotguns compared to like a traditional
0:09:54.320,0:10:00.519
lead shot load um you know in the same
0:09:57.959,0:10:05.160
same gauge like in a 12
0:10:00.519,0:10:07.560
age yeah so that is a that's a tricky
0:10:05.160,0:10:10.720
question because the shotgun setups are
0:10:07.560,0:10:13.880
so pin to get one you know what's
0:10:10.720,0:10:17.720
possible is like let's say let's say
0:10:13.880,0:10:21.079
let's say you've got you know your um
0:10:17.720,0:10:23.640
your shotgun is you've got it you know
0:10:21.079,0:10:25.920
dialed in son you got to just the exact
0:10:23.640,0:10:28.000
right choke tube in it that's slinging
0:10:25.920,0:10:31.480
lead shot whatever you're choosing
0:10:28.000,0:10:34.279
whether it be BB or number fours or t-
0:10:31.480,0:10:38.079
shot or whatever it is what it's optimal
0:10:34.279,0:10:40.680
for your shotgun with a lead shot then
0:10:38.079,0:10:43.560
compare it to what an optimal type load
0:10:40.680,0:10:44.920
and choke setup vers you know versus TSS
0:10:43.560,0:10:47.639
what's the big difference like what's
0:10:44.920,0:10:49.480
your max range for that that lead type
0:10:47.639,0:10:53.880
load your traditional shotgun loads
0:10:49.480,0:10:56.639
versus a TSS load yeah so a shotgun that
0:10:53.880,0:10:58.240
is is dialed in shooting lead shot and
0:10:56.639,0:11:01.480
I'm talking about number four buck
0:10:58.240,0:11:04.079
t-shot TVs stuff like that and you'll
0:11:01.480,0:11:06.600
hear and see all the posts people
0:11:04.079,0:11:09.360
talking a lot farther ranges but
0:11:06.600,0:11:12.240
truthfully 40 to 50 yards with a shotgun
0:11:09.360,0:11:14.880
that's dialed in with lead shot that's
0:11:12.240,0:11:16.959
about your your max effective range and
0:11:14.880,0:11:19.440
you really want them when I was shooting
0:11:16.959,0:11:21.920
the lead stuff and mine was dialed in I
0:11:19.440,0:11:23.680
mean I could I could knock them down and
0:11:21.920,0:11:25.160
hit them at farther distance is no
0:11:23.680,0:11:28.440
problem but killing them was a different
0:11:25.160,0:11:30.240
thing so effective range to to get that
0:11:28.440,0:11:32.800
Co killed
0:11:30.240,0:11:37.160
I wanted him inside 40 yards with number
0:11:32.800,0:11:40.040
four Buck or t-shot or BBS and outside
0:11:37.160,0:11:42.160
of that I wouldn't mess with any
0:11:40.040,0:11:45.040
anything else leadwise when you go into
0:11:42.160,0:11:47.000
your larger buck shot sizes you have
0:11:45.040,0:11:50.720
such few pellets that you just don't
0:11:47.000,0:11:53.839
have the pattern density down range and
0:11:50.720,0:11:56.560
then if you go smaller than BBS you run
0:11:53.839,0:11:58.200
into penetration issues down range so
0:11:56.560,0:12:00.639
that was the problem with lead and
0:11:58.200,0:12:04.800
that's why TSS was such a game changer
0:12:00.639,0:12:08.000
so when you compare the lead stuff
0:12:04.800,0:12:12.480
versus the TSS and I'm shooting the Apex
0:12:08.000,0:12:15.320
TSS always have when you compare the two
0:12:12.480,0:12:18.000
your effective range doubles or more
0:12:15.320,0:12:21.360
than double so I just killed a code on
0:12:18.000,0:12:23.519
video all in February and I had a
0:12:21.360,0:12:26.120
rangefinder with me it's 96 and a half
0:12:23.519,0:12:28.000
yard shot him with number two Apex and
0:12:26.120,0:12:29.920
I've got several more on video that are
0:12:28.000,0:12:33.760
in that you know
0:12:29.920,0:12:36.079
75 to 100 yards range and these CS are
0:12:33.760,0:12:38.480
not necessarily standing their ideal
0:12:36.079,0:12:40.399
facing you you know they may be turned
0:12:38.480,0:12:42.240
to leave and that's sometimes that's why
0:12:40.399,0:12:45.079
you're taking a long shot on them with
0:12:42.240,0:12:47.680
with TSS because they they are leaving
0:12:45.079,0:12:49.120
right and that's why always you know
0:12:47.680,0:12:52.320
always said that shoot him in the tail
0:12:49.120,0:12:54.920
knock your teeth out deal is because it
0:12:52.320,0:12:58.240
has it's a lot
0:12:54.920,0:13:00.920
smaller di the TSS is a lot smaller than
0:12:58.240,0:13:05.240
your lead and has more penetrating
0:13:00.920,0:13:07.279
ability down range so huge difference
0:13:05.240,0:13:10.160
and your effective range you know with a
0:13:07.279,0:13:14.560
gun like mine you take my gun dialed in
0:13:10.160,0:13:17.399
on lead 40 yards 50 yards max with the
0:13:14.560,0:13:20.920
TSS stuff I won't hesitate at 70 80
0:13:17.399,0:13:24.079
yards and I am confident I will take a
0:13:20.920,0:13:26.079
shot out to in that 100 100 plus it's
0:13:24.079,0:13:29.839
rated the number two stuff that I shoot
0:13:26.079,0:13:34.040
a lot of it's rated for C size animals
0:13:29.839,0:13:36.440
at 107 yards right so penetration wise
0:13:34.040,0:13:37.959
so that just shows you how and for
0:13:36.440,0:13:40.920
comparison you know I knew we were going
0:13:37.959,0:13:42.240
to do this deal and uh for comparison
0:13:40.920,0:13:48.920
your lead
0:13:42.240,0:13:51.360
stuff is 11 34 grams per cubic C
0:13:48.920,0:13:54.120
centimeter yep that's the density that's
0:13:51.360,0:13:57.079
the density of it compare that the TSS
0:13:54.120,0:13:59.720
at 18.1 G
0:13:57.079,0:14:02.600
so difference y
0:13:59.720,0:14:05.199
you know the people tried to argue it me
0:14:02.600,0:14:07.920
included I was a skeptic but after
0:14:05.199,0:14:10.360
getting it shooting it there is very few
0:14:07.920,0:14:12.360
people try to argue that the TSS versus
0:14:10.360,0:14:14.240
lead deal now and I'm not saying you
0:14:12.360,0:14:16.279
can't set up your gun and shoot shoot it
0:14:14.240,0:14:18.600
with a lead y like I said if you're
0:14:16.279,0:14:20.680
gonna do that the lead stuff is a lot
0:14:18.600,0:14:24.360
cheaper you know and shooting something
0:14:20.680,0:14:27.040
like BBS t-shot or number four Buck
0:14:24.360,0:14:30.199
that's kind of where you want to be uh
0:14:27.040,0:14:33.120
with your lead stuff and just you know
0:14:30.199,0:14:35.120
keep those shots in inside 40 yards and
0:14:33.120,0:14:36.920
you do pretty good one thing is
0:14:35.120,0:14:38.759
interesting here and you know and I've
0:14:36.920,0:14:41.839
experience this because I've you know I
0:14:38.759,0:14:45.600
used to run a shotgun a little bit back
0:14:41.839,0:14:48.040
years ago um you had run in some bad
0:14:45.600,0:14:50.160
luck stuff with coyotes and bobcats
0:14:48.040,0:14:54.120
getting away from me from trying to
0:14:50.160,0:14:56.959
stretch my shots out too far with um
0:14:54.120,0:14:59.560
like your heavy shot dead Co type stuff
0:14:56.959,0:15:01.639
and your more traditional lead Lo and I
0:14:59.560,0:15:03.839
was just just losing a lot of animals so
0:15:01.639,0:15:06.240
I kind of got away from it and then here
0:15:03.839,0:15:08.480
over the last year or so I've kind of
0:15:06.240,0:15:10.000
crept back into it dabbling because I've
0:15:08.480,0:15:14.240
seen you know I've got intrigued by the
0:15:10.000,0:15:16.399
TSS and seen the results from you and
0:15:14.240,0:15:18.279
some other Hunters that's just been so
0:15:16.399,0:15:21.360
impressed I was like you know I I got to
0:15:18.279,0:15:23.560
try it and I've seen how lethal it can
0:15:21.360,0:15:25.079
be but one thing that was interesting
0:15:23.560,0:15:27.000
you was kind of talking about there a
0:15:25.079,0:15:29.160
little bit and I don't know if everybody
0:15:27.000,0:15:30.360
else has picked up on it but you're
0:15:29.160,0:15:33.480
about shooting your lead loads and
0:15:30.360,0:15:35.839
shooting like number four Buck well when
0:15:33.480,0:15:37.240
it's go to the TSS you said number fours
0:15:35.839,0:15:39.000
but you're not talking about number four
0:15:37.240,0:15:42.279
Buck you're talking about like a bird
0:15:39.000,0:15:44.319
shot size number four Turkey Bird shot
0:15:42.279,0:15:46.720
yeah yeah yeah big difference in size
0:15:44.319,0:15:50.639
that number four bird shot turkey load
0:15:46.720,0:15:53.399
is a lot smaller than a number four for
0:15:50.639,0:15:55.560
okay for a comparison a 3 inch and some
0:15:53.399,0:15:57.959
shell manufacturers will differ just a
0:15:55.560,0:16:00.240
little bit but on your pellet counts so
0:15:57.959,0:16:04.440
a number four buck shot most of them in
0:16:00.240,0:16:06.800
a 3-in shell is going to hold 41 pellets
0:16:04.440,0:16:11.279
so 41 pellets in number for buck shot
0:16:06.800,0:16:14.560
compare that to a number four bir shot
0:16:11.279,0:16:17.160
in PSS that has more penetration than
0:16:14.560,0:16:22.120
the number four Buckshot but a number
0:16:17.160,0:16:26.680
four uh Apex 3inch load it's 166 bellet
0:16:22.120,0:16:29.720
so 41 versus 166 yeah so you just see
0:16:26.680,0:16:32.680
the pattern density difference from a
0:16:29.720,0:16:34.880
number four bird shot in PSS and a
0:16:32.680,0:16:36.920
number four buck in lead and if you
0:16:34.880,0:16:38.880
tried to shoot a c with number four bird
0:16:36.920,0:16:41.759
shot with
0:16:38.880,0:16:44.600
lead which would be the same size good
0:16:41.759,0:16:46.279
luck probably he's probably gonna jump
0:16:44.600,0:16:50.240
up and run off unless you get him up
0:16:46.279,0:16:51.600
there you know 20 yard close yeah yeah
0:16:50.240,0:16:53.160
yeah and I still wouldn't want to shoot
0:16:51.600,0:16:55.920
him with it you know it's just you're
0:16:53.160,0:16:57.759
running the risk and like you know going
0:16:55.920,0:17:00.000
back to the lead deal and you say you
0:16:57.759,0:17:02.199
run into trouble I ran into trouble I
0:17:00.000,0:17:04.400
knew what my gun would do but one of the
0:17:02.199,0:17:07.600
things that I like about TSS and why
0:17:04.400,0:17:09.799
it's made the shotgun game so much
0:17:07.600,0:17:11.839
better is when you're sitting there
0:17:09.799,0:17:13.559
looking 40 yards there's a lot of
0:17:11.839,0:17:16.079
shotgun stands that you make that you
0:17:13.559,0:17:17.559
can see beyond 40 yards you know
0:17:16.079,0:17:18.679
especially if you're in a field or
0:17:17.559,0:17:20.720
something but typically people are
0:17:18.679,0:17:22.959
hunting thicker stuff you can still see
0:17:20.720,0:17:25.039
40 yards a lot of times and when you got
0:17:22.959,0:17:28.199
a cow come running in if your effective
0:17:25.039,0:17:31.240
range is you know that 40 yard Mark and
0:17:28.199,0:17:33.760
a couch stops out there spur of the
0:17:31.240,0:17:36.760
moment trying to gauge is he 40 or is he
0:17:33.760,0:17:38.760
60 you know and you don't have any
0:17:36.760,0:17:41.520
insurance or you don't have much
0:17:38.760,0:17:43.720
insurance with those lead loads right
0:17:41.520,0:17:46.200
when you're shooting the TSS
0:17:43.720,0:17:48.240
stuff that's that's what I love about it
0:17:46.200,0:17:50.480
when I'm sitting in the woods rarely can
0:17:48.240,0:17:53.440
I know I've got a 100 yard gun rarely
0:17:50.480,0:17:55.159
can I see a hundred yards in the thick
0:17:53.440,0:17:58.360
you know when you start seeing fur he's
0:17:55.159,0:18:00.919
in trouble I can shoot him I'm not
0:17:58.360,0:18:03.360
guessing I've let Coes get away or not
0:18:00.919,0:18:06.520
taking a shot because I'm when I was
0:18:03.360,0:18:08.280
shooting lead because I was hesitant
0:18:06.520,0:18:10.000
trying to guess yardage you know and
0:18:08.280,0:18:11.600
spur the moment trying to guess you know
0:18:10.000,0:18:12.960
is he close enough especially if you
0:18:11.600,0:18:15.400
know how it is going back and forth
0:18:12.960,0:18:16.919
between a camera and the gun oh yeah you
0:18:15.400,0:18:19.120
look in that camera screen that you
0:18:16.919,0:18:22.440
don't have any idea how far that Cod is
0:18:19.120,0:18:25.320
right for the most part so the TSS stuff
0:18:22.440,0:18:28.000
is you know there's a lot of insurance
0:18:25.320,0:18:30.000
there when you start seeing the coat
0:18:28.000,0:18:32.039
more than likely
0:18:30.000,0:18:34.400
you can kill him hey that kind of made
0:18:32.039,0:18:36.120
me think you was talking about that it
0:18:34.400,0:18:38.240
made me think on our hunt back in March
0:18:36.120,0:18:40.200
we went down and hun with Chris me and
0:18:38.240,0:18:42.320
you and uh that very first stand we
0:18:40.200,0:18:44.080
caught a bobcat up and I could tell he
0:18:42.320,0:18:45.799
was going to get plenty close enough and
0:18:44.080,0:18:48.080
I was you know i' looked over at I was
0:18:45.799,0:18:50.600
like Hey burn that thing down with that
0:18:48.080,0:18:52.400
shotgun when it gets up here well Chris
0:18:50.600,0:18:54.039
had heard me say it and Chris is nervous
0:18:52.400,0:18:56.200
is can be cuz he never been around the
0:18:54.039,0:18:58.000
TSS stuff and that cat gets up I can't
0:18:56.200,0:19:00.360
remember what it was what was 60 70
0:18:58.000,0:19:02.240
yards or something locked up oh yeah and
0:19:00.360,0:19:03.080
he's like I'd Rather somebody shoot it
0:19:02.240,0:19:07.039
with a
0:19:03.080,0:19:08.799
rifle so I I had the confidence in that
0:19:07.039,0:19:10.880
in that shotgun but you know Chris
0:19:08.799,0:19:14.000
didn't he had not been around a TSS and
0:19:10.880,0:19:16.440
see what it was capable of yeah and it
0:19:14.000,0:19:18.559
does take I completely understood you
0:19:16.440,0:19:22.320
know his thinking on it because when I
0:19:18.559,0:19:23.919
swapped over to the TSS the Apex had
0:19:22.320,0:19:26.520
contact me wanted me to shoot some of it
0:19:23.919,0:19:29.240
I was extremely skeptical and almost
0:19:26.520,0:19:31.000
rude about it saying you know this is
0:19:29.240,0:19:33.159
what what the claims were I was thinking
0:19:31.000,0:19:35.440
you know this is some BS it's not GNA do
0:19:33.159,0:19:39.120
that on the C and so when I first
0:19:35.440,0:19:41.400
started shooting it I was hesitant to
0:19:39.120,0:19:44.400
shoot those coachs past what I had shot
0:19:41.400,0:19:47.440
them you know using lead so it took it
0:19:44.400,0:19:49.320
took a handful of coats to see what it
0:19:47.440,0:19:50.960
was capable of you know pulling the
0:19:49.320,0:19:52.679
trigger on them a little bit farther and
0:19:50.960,0:19:57.240
a lot of times that was a coat that was
0:19:52.679,0:19:59.039
leaving and you shoot them and just man
0:19:57.240,0:20:00.640
that thing bold it up and you walk up
0:19:59.039,0:20:03.840
there tomb and he's broke from one end
0:20:00.640,0:20:06.000
to the other yeah you start yeah you
0:20:03.840,0:20:09.520
start gaining confidence in it then and
0:20:06.000,0:20:11.760
now you know when I shot that go at 96
0:20:09.520,0:20:14.320
yards the only reason I shot that go
0:20:11.760,0:20:16.320
that part was so thick I couldn't set up
0:20:14.320,0:20:18.720
in the woods like I typically do I was
0:20:16.320,0:20:20.679
looking down a dead end Gravel Road and
0:20:18.720,0:20:22.520
a pair of coats come out in the road
0:20:20.679,0:20:24.679
course they look down the gravel to rec
0:20:22.520,0:20:26.640
call was couldn't see what they thought
0:20:24.679,0:20:28.159
they heard and one coat turned and went
0:20:26.640,0:20:29.840
back in so I knew the other one it
0:20:28.159,0:20:31.640
turned around and I knew it was going to
0:20:29.840,0:20:33.720
do the same thing I didn't have a clue
0:20:31.640,0:20:36.039
how part it was I knew it was way down
0:20:33.720,0:20:37.559
there I took a rang finder with me
0:20:36.039,0:20:39.559
because I knew I was going to set up in
0:20:37.559,0:20:42.240
that Gravel Road and I had intentions of
0:20:39.559,0:20:45.320
ranging about you know 50 60 yards down
0:20:42.240,0:20:47.360
the gravel to give me an idea of how far
0:20:45.320,0:20:48.840
it was but I forgot the ranging thing so
0:20:47.360,0:20:50.320
when the coats popped out and they
0:20:48.840,0:20:52.320
turned to leave I said well I'm gonna
0:20:50.320,0:20:55.240
send one down there
0:20:52.320,0:20:57.640
probably probably too far I shoot and
0:20:55.240,0:20:59.320
the Goat falls in the road and makes it
0:20:57.640,0:21:01.039
across the ditch Bank think I walk down
0:20:59.320,0:21:02.280
there and I don't even walk quite far
0:21:01.039,0:21:04.400
enough of course I keep the camera
0:21:02.280,0:21:06.600
running this whole time yeah there's no
0:21:04.400,0:21:09.200
Cuts in it to get down there and I
0:21:06.600,0:21:11.240
couldn't find anything I said dang man I
0:21:09.200,0:21:13.400
looked back to where my camera was
0:21:11.240,0:21:16.080
sitting and I said Lord that's a long
0:21:13.400,0:21:17.840
ways I still had range this at the time
0:21:16.080,0:21:19.679
and so I walk about another 10 yards or
0:21:17.840,0:21:21.440
so far and I see where the coat just
0:21:19.679,0:21:22.679
scratched the road up a couple drops of
0:21:21.440,0:21:24.320
blood and I look over there and right
0:21:22.679,0:21:26.600
across the ditch Bank there he lays you
0:21:24.320,0:21:29.200
know five yard from I shot dead in a
0:21:26.600,0:21:30.880
hammer oh yeah and I shot the go you
0:21:29.200,0:21:32.520
know kind of turned angling away from me
0:21:30.880,0:21:35.559
it wasn't a hit on shot or anything so
0:21:32.520,0:21:38.919
you had to drive pellets on up into the
0:21:35.559,0:21:41.400
vitals quarter away yeah yeah and it was
0:21:38.919,0:21:43.360
a big old I mean pair pair of breeding
0:21:41.400,0:21:46.279
coats big old coat I can't remember I
0:21:43.360,0:21:49.720
think it was a male anyway I stood right
0:21:46.279,0:21:51.600
there and ranged back to my to my chair
0:21:49.720,0:21:53.440
there where I was sitting at 96 and a
0:21:51.600,0:21:55.279
half yards and that's with the rang
0:21:53.440,0:21:58.360
finder you know so it wasn't any
0:21:55.279,0:22:02.720
exaggerated steps or right anything like
0:21:58.360,0:22:04.880
that giv given distance to it so uh it's
0:22:02.720,0:22:05.960
some bad stuff it is some bad stuff and
0:22:04.880,0:22:07.279
it's like you know if you've got
0:22:05.960,0:22:10.520
everything dial in you know you're
0:22:07.279,0:22:12.600
shooting right shotgun right choke
0:22:10.520,0:22:13.880
combination with whatever you know I've
0:22:12.600,0:22:16.080
been shooting number four shot I know
0:22:13.880,0:22:20.120
you like the TW and the two and four
0:22:16.080,0:22:22.840
Blends but if you if you get one kind of
0:22:20.120,0:22:26.000
CAU up in that right yardage where your
0:22:22.840,0:22:27.320
pattern really spreads out and you got
0:22:26.000,0:22:29.760
still got a lot of density and it's
0:22:27.320,0:22:32.120
hitting that Coy all over over man it's
0:22:29.760,0:22:33.919
like you go pick those coyotes up that's
0:22:32.120,0:22:35.400
just like caught the full load where it
0:22:33.919,0:22:37.840
spreads out a little bit it's almost
0:22:35.400,0:22:39.360
like diabolical what it does with these
0:22:37.840,0:22:41.240
Coy cuz you pick them up they're just
0:22:39.360,0:22:43.520
flopping all over the place everything's
0:22:41.240,0:22:45.760
busted up and broke stuff crunching and
0:22:43.520,0:22:49.559
grinding in them it's nasty
0:22:45.760,0:22:51.640
almost it does a number on them it is
0:22:49.559,0:22:54.000
and the thing about this is where people
0:22:51.640,0:22:56.480
go wrong with shotgunning and you see it
0:22:54.000,0:22:58.520
in post after post after post I had
0:22:56.480,0:23:01.159
people call me Non-Stop about the
0:22:58.520,0:23:04.600
shotgun stuff about the loads for one
0:23:01.159,0:23:06.480
TSS is fairly expensive and we just had
0:23:04.600,0:23:08.600
a conver you know we've been talking for
0:23:06.480,0:23:10.679
last five minutes about how good it is
0:23:08.600,0:23:14.080
and what it'll do to codes but you
0:23:10.679,0:23:16.919
cannot skip patterning your gun finding
0:23:14.080,0:23:18.600
the right choke and like you said you
0:23:16.919,0:23:20.559
like the fours I like the twos and the
0:23:18.600,0:23:22.799
two four Blends depending on what gun
0:23:20.559,0:23:25.760
you're shooting and what your choke
0:23:22.799,0:23:28.720
shell combination is that is key and a
0:23:25.760,0:23:30.960
step that cannot be skipped if you want
0:23:28.720,0:23:33.559
to get those results and people are bad
0:23:30.960,0:23:36.799
about I mean it
0:23:33.559,0:23:39.159
nobody optimal results yeah for sure I
0:23:36.799,0:23:40.760
don't people take a shotgun they pick it
0:23:39.159,0:23:42.480
up and they think well I can just point
0:23:40.760,0:23:44.760
this thing in the general direction of
0:23:42.480,0:23:47.559
what I want to kill and it's supposed to
0:23:44.760,0:23:50.159
yeah send a a spray of fets down there
0:23:47.559,0:23:52.000
and hit you know all that whole area
0:23:50.159,0:23:53.880
that I'm looking and pointing at and
0:23:52.000,0:23:57.760
that's not how it works you know it's
0:23:53.880,0:23:59.640
not that it it's kind of that concept
0:23:57.760,0:24:02.559
but you need to diid in if you want to
0:23:59.640,0:24:03.960
get the results we're talking about and
0:24:02.559,0:24:06.320
people will you know they'll take
0:24:03.960,0:24:09.200
whatever their shotgun is they'll spend
0:24:06.320,0:24:10.440
the money on some Apex Tu fours because
0:24:09.200,0:24:11.840
they've heard us talk about how good
0:24:10.440,0:24:14.039
they are they'll stick them in their gun
0:24:11.840,0:24:16.840
without patterning it go out and shoot
0:24:14.039,0:24:18.080
it Cs and then they'll call and say man
0:24:16.840,0:24:20.279
I've been shooting this stuff I'm not
0:24:18.080,0:24:23.120
having good results well have you
0:24:20.279,0:24:26.360
patterned your gun and if you haven't
0:24:23.120,0:24:29.000
you may be hitting two foot low and a
0:24:26.360,0:24:31.559
foot to the right or even worse or have
0:24:29.000,0:24:33.919
a choke in there that's got you know
0:24:31.559,0:24:36.799
where you're aiming at you may have a
0:24:33.919,0:24:40.440
hole yeah two three foot circle there
0:24:36.799,0:24:42.000
with just sporadic pellet placement and
0:24:40.440,0:24:44.039
if if that's what you've got then you're
0:24:42.000,0:24:46.520
not going to get those you know those
0:24:44.039,0:24:50.320
results so you've gotta find you've got
0:24:46.520,0:24:52.120
to you've got to spend the money to
0:24:50.320,0:24:53.600
pattern the gun to get the gun and
0:24:52.120,0:24:55.080
people don't hesitate to do that with
0:24:53.600,0:24:57.360
their rifle if they would look at the
0:24:55.080,0:25:00.440
shotgun just like they do setting up
0:24:57.360,0:25:03.120
their rifle sight in their rifle their
0:25:00.440,0:25:05.320
you know their bullet weight grain and
0:25:03.120,0:25:07.440
how that changes if they change bullets
0:25:05.320,0:25:10.039
the whole deal and you know you never
0:25:07.440,0:25:12.480
see me comment or talk about rifle
0:25:10.039,0:25:15.080
setups because I'm not experienced
0:25:12.480,0:25:18.559
enough to talk about that stuff but when
0:25:15.080,0:25:21.559
it comes to the shotguns a lot of what
0:25:18.559,0:25:24.720
goes into a rifle still applies to
0:25:21.559,0:25:27.240
setting up a shot gun you know to a
0:25:24.720,0:25:29.559
certain degree right so you've got to
0:25:27.240,0:25:31.039
set that gun up well since you're
0:25:29.559,0:25:32.799
talking about what are you currently
0:25:31.039,0:25:35.320
running you know like what is your
0:25:32.799,0:25:37.000
shotgun what you choke tube and
0:25:35.320,0:25:38.200
constriction that you're running and of
0:25:37.000,0:25:42.080
course you're talk we know you're
0:25:38.200,0:25:44.799
running some TSS the Apex stuff uh twos
0:25:42.080,0:25:46.600
and fours or a two and four blend or
0:25:44.799,0:25:50.559
number twos but what's your shotgun set
0:25:46.600,0:25:53.760
up and your choke tube combination like
0:25:50.559,0:25:56.640
so I'm shooting the old uh actually got
0:25:53.760,0:26:00.080
two of them now just an old Remington
0:25:56.640,0:26:01.760
870 and I'm not brand loyal to you know
0:26:00.080,0:26:03.679
I don't have any ties to any brands or
0:26:01.760,0:26:06.760
anything with shotguns that's just what
0:26:03.679,0:26:09.120
I started with when I was a kid and when
0:26:06.760,0:26:10.880
I got into the turkey hunting stuff I
0:26:09.120,0:26:13.080
was dragging I was crawling on these
0:26:10.880,0:26:14.840
turkeys dragging a shotgun around by a
0:26:13.080,0:26:18.080
slang through the mud and that thing
0:26:14.840,0:26:21.039
always shot so I've always had good luck
0:26:18.080,0:26:23.679
with them reli reliability that's that's
0:26:21.039,0:26:25.080
why I like it and I've been able to get
0:26:23.679,0:26:26.880
you know I've been able to find
0:26:25.080,0:26:30.480
regardless of the shotgun brand I think
0:26:26.880,0:26:33.000
you can find choke shell combination
0:26:30.480,0:26:35.399
that's gonna shoot really good but I'm
0:26:33.000,0:26:37.279
shooting that old Remington 870 I've got
0:26:35.399,0:26:39.679
when I was shooting lead stuff I was
0:26:37.279,0:26:43.039
shooting a
0:26:39.679,0:26:44.880
670 670 I was shooting a a factory
0:26:43.039,0:26:47.279
Remington choke I tried two or three
0:26:44.880,0:26:49.520
other ones they performed about the same
0:26:47.279,0:26:52.080
uh but I ended up shooting a 670
0:26:49.520,0:26:54.640
Remington Factory choke when I was
0:26:52.080,0:26:57.520
shooting the lead stuff and I shot BBS
0:26:54.640,0:26:58.919
and number four Buck uh the BBS
0:26:57.520,0:27:01.480
performed the B
0:26:58.919,0:27:03.760
but you get a c 40 plus yards I'd knock
0:27:01.480,0:27:05.039
some of them down if his tail was
0:27:03.760,0:27:09.200
twitching I better shoot him a couple
0:27:05.039,0:27:11.960
more times all the number four Buck was
0:27:09.200,0:27:14.120
better at anchoring the coats in that 40
0:27:11.960,0:27:17.320
yard range but the pattern density out
0:27:14.120,0:27:20.039
that 670 wasn't quite as good so you
0:27:17.320,0:27:21.760
know and t- shot I never could get t-
0:27:20.039,0:27:23.320
shot that's a good one to try if
0:27:21.760,0:27:25.200
somebody's patterning with lead but I
0:27:23.320,0:27:27.440
never could get t-shot to pattern very
0:27:25.200,0:27:30.720
good out of my gun or the chokes I had
0:27:27.440,0:27:32.720
so I shot BBS and the number four Buck
0:27:30.720,0:27:34.919
out of that and then when I went to the
0:27:32.720,0:27:39.399
TSS didn't shoot very good out of that
0:27:34.919,0:27:42.799
670 y so I had to had to try some chokes
0:27:39.399,0:27:47.360
and at the time I was working with Apex
0:27:42.799,0:27:50.360
and Indian Creek was doing some custom
0:27:47.360,0:27:55.159
choke tube building for the TSS they
0:27:50.360,0:27:57.960
sent me some chokes and I had a 680 that
0:27:55.159,0:28:01.360
they sent me it was a custom build and
0:27:57.960,0:28:03.360
that is the choke out of the six seven
0:28:01.360,0:28:05.320
eight chokes that I tried that choke
0:28:03.360,0:28:09.360
patterned really well with the number
0:28:05.320,0:28:14.519
twos the Apex TSS number twos and then
0:28:09.360,0:28:16.360
eventually uh the Apex TSS 2s and I gave
0:28:14.519,0:28:19.000
them feed you know I was hunting coats
0:28:16.360,0:28:20.640
and shooting paper and everything else
0:28:19.000,0:28:22.600
and giving them feedback on how the
0:28:20.640,0:28:26.320
shells were performing and that's kind
0:28:22.600,0:28:30.200
of how I got a relationship with Apex
0:28:26.320,0:28:31.559
and those two and two fours and the
0:28:30.200,0:28:34.039
number
0:28:31.559,0:28:38.320
fours is what I think people should be
0:28:34.039,0:28:40.720
shooting in the TSS stuff for CS I've
0:28:38.320,0:28:43.679
always shot the twos and the two before
0:28:40.720,0:28:46.760
because they pattern so well out of my
0:28:43.679,0:28:50.000
reming an 870 with that 680 Indian Creek
0:28:46.760,0:28:52.080
joke but there are other people and some
0:28:50.000,0:28:54.000
of them are shooting a 870 you they're
0:28:52.080,0:28:55.679
shooting a similar setup to me but they
0:28:54.000,0:28:57.600
get better results like you said you're
0:28:55.679,0:28:58.640
shooting the fours they'll get a better
0:28:57.600,0:29:00.960
pattern
0:28:58.640,0:29:02.960
out of the fours and that's another
0:29:00.960,0:29:05.279
tricky thing I'm I'm sure rifles are
0:29:02.960,0:29:07.880
probably the same way you can have the
0:29:05.279,0:29:11.519
same brand shotgun put the exact same
0:29:07.880,0:29:14.080
choke tube in it the exact same shells
0:29:11.519,0:29:16.679
and there's still a difference
0:29:14.080,0:29:19.320
between this gun even though they're set
0:29:16.679,0:29:21.799
up the same with the same supposed to be
0:29:19.320,0:29:23.760
same specs one of them will pattern a
0:29:21.799,0:29:24.919
little different than the other one so
0:29:23.760,0:29:27.320
you
0:29:24.919,0:29:29.000
may you may shoot the same gun I'm
0:29:27.320,0:29:31.559
shooting but you may need a different
0:29:29.000,0:29:34.080
joke than what I'm shooting uh but it
0:29:31.559,0:29:36.200
should still get you in that ballark one
0:29:34.080,0:29:39.200
thing I've noticed about t like if we're
0:29:36.200,0:29:41.360
talking TSS and of course guys we're not
0:29:39.200,0:29:43.080
we're not trying to sell you on TSS and
0:29:41.360,0:29:45.120
push you towards it but we're going to
0:29:43.080,0:29:47.559
talk about a lot because it is that
0:29:45.120,0:29:50.200
lethal you know we both shot both but in
0:29:47.559,0:29:52.159
the TSS it is high there's a lot of
0:29:50.200,0:29:53.840
companies that's loading shells for TSS
0:29:52.159,0:29:56.080
nowadays so it's pretty easy to find
0:29:53.840,0:29:58.519
anymore uh but don't think we're saying
0:29:56.080,0:30:00.399
that you've got to Sho TSS you can't
0:29:58.519,0:30:01.919
shotgun coyes it's not what we're saying
0:30:00.399,0:30:04.760
but we're just letting you know what is
0:30:01.919,0:30:06.840
the best and TSS is the best but what I
0:30:04.760,0:30:08.679
was going to say there to it seems like
0:30:06.840,0:30:13.000
when you do switch over to
0:30:08.679,0:30:15.039
TSS it seems like from my experiences uh
0:30:13.000,0:30:16.399
I got to open my choke up more I got to
0:30:15.039,0:30:18.559
shoot a choke it's just a little bit
0:30:16.399,0:30:19.880
more open than what I was shooting like
0:30:18.559,0:30:21.399
a lot of people want to just use like
0:30:19.880,0:30:24.960
their turkey choke they'll try to take
0:30:21.399,0:30:26.519
like a a 665 uh turkey choke out 12
0:30:24.960,0:30:28.519
gauge and try to shoot some number twos
0:30:26.519,0:30:30.200
or number four TSS they find out it
0:30:28.519,0:30:33.640
don't pattern the same and they got to
0:30:30.200,0:30:36.480
open it on up to like a 680 or even a
0:30:33.640,0:30:39.440
you know over seven you know
0:30:36.480,0:30:42.000
so yeah that's a good point most
0:30:39.440,0:30:44.399
manufacturers and and shotgun Brands
0:30:42.000,0:30:46.559
outside of Remington but but even
0:30:44.399,0:30:49.559
including Remington most of your
0:30:46.559,0:30:51.679
recommend recommended choke tubes for
0:30:49.559,0:30:54.080
shooting TSS in that range we were
0:30:51.679,0:30:55.840
talking about fours two fours twos
0:30:54.080,0:30:58.720
they're typically up there in that you
0:30:55.840,0:31:01.880
know 700 7
0:30:58.720,0:31:03.559
.71 stuff like that they're in that more
0:31:01.880,0:31:05.320
and if people want to compare that you
0:31:03.559,0:31:08.399
know some people don't know what that
0:31:05.320,0:31:10.360
means that's getting you into what and
0:31:08.399,0:31:13.279
again depending on what chart you're
0:31:10.360,0:31:15.159
looking at who puts it out you may have
0:31:13.279,0:31:17.279
some differences on what somebody would
0:31:15.159,0:31:19.320
call a full choke modified improve
0:31:17.279,0:31:24.760
cylinder and so on but typically that
0:31:19.320,0:31:28.639
gets you in that modified choke range so
0:31:24.760,0:31:30.320
most of your most of your guns
0:31:28.639,0:31:36.600
and gun brands are going to shoot the
0:31:30.320,0:31:38.799
TSS stuff in that modified or 700 to 17
0:31:36.600,0:31:41.039
range that's a good I guess what I'm
0:31:38.799,0:31:43.559
getting at is that's a good place to
0:31:41.039,0:31:46.240
start and then you may need to adjust
0:31:43.559,0:31:49.480
one way or the other just a little bit
0:31:46.240,0:31:52.679
to really fine tune what joke is going
0:31:49.480,0:31:55.919
to shoot the best out of your particular
0:31:52.679,0:31:56.919
gun what do you think about one thing I
0:31:55.919,0:31:59.679
was going to ask you earlier when we was
0:31:56.919,0:32:02.080
talking about the compar a TSS and
0:31:59.679,0:32:03.480
traditional lead shot did you try did
0:32:02.080,0:32:05.440
you ever play with any of the dead
0:32:03.480,0:32:07.360
coyote stuff you know it's it's actually
0:32:05.440,0:32:10.120
heavy shot which I think is totally
0:32:07.360,0:32:12.080
different than DSS and and traditional
0:32:10.120,0:32:13.760
lead I don't really know what the specs
0:32:12.080,0:32:16.440
of it are but I know it's heavier than
0:32:13.760,0:32:18.200
lead or denser than lead but not near as
0:32:16.440,0:32:19.200
dense as TSS is that correct kind of
0:32:18.200,0:32:21.480
Falls in
0:32:19.200,0:32:23.519
between yep that's right I don't
0:32:21.480,0:32:26.600
remember what the density specs are on
0:32:23.519,0:32:30.000
it but the dead coat uh
0:32:26.600,0:32:35.039
t-shot I I think it was an in inch of
0:32:30.000,0:32:39.960
ounce and a half load with 51 pellets in
0:32:35.039,0:32:42.000
the Shell so you know yeah on those when
0:32:39.960,0:32:46.080
I shot BBS I was shooting the Hornady
0:32:42.000,0:32:49.559
Magnums yep and there were 70 I believe
0:32:46.080,0:32:52.600
there were 77 pellets in it and I think
0:32:49.559,0:32:54.639
they were ounce and a half and then the
0:32:52.600,0:32:56.399
dead Co t-shot that you're talking about
0:32:54.639,0:32:58.840
which was pretty popular you know a lot
0:32:56.399,0:33:00.399
of people shot it I did play with it to
0:32:58.840,0:33:02.240
answer your question I did play with it
0:33:00.399,0:33:03.240
I played with the Hornady stuff and I
0:33:02.240,0:33:05.399
played with two or three different
0:33:03.240,0:33:07.159
brands but I shot the Hornady BBS in
0:33:05.399,0:33:11.120
lead they're actually I think nickel
0:33:07.159,0:33:13.399
plated lead U and then the t-shot and
0:33:11.120,0:33:17.360
dead Co and then I shot two or three
0:33:13.399,0:33:21.880
different U Federal Winchester Remington
0:33:17.360,0:33:23.720
and a number four buck with 41 bellet so
0:33:21.880,0:33:28.080
all of
0:33:23.720,0:33:30.159
those you know they are
0:33:28.080,0:33:32.080
they are what you want to shoot if
0:33:30.159,0:33:35.080
you're going to shoot lead and I killed
0:33:32.080,0:33:37.159
piles and piles of coats with that stuff
0:33:35.080,0:33:39.000
before the TSS stuff ever came out and
0:33:37.159,0:33:41.840
was reluctant like I said I was a
0:33:39.000,0:33:45.360
skeptic of the TSS stuff I was reluctant
0:33:41.840,0:33:48.200
to to get away from shooting the BBS or
0:33:45.360,0:33:49.360
the number four Buck but uh yeah to
0:33:48.200,0:33:52.080
answer your question I played with the
0:33:49.360,0:33:55.960
dead Co t-shot and I just never could
0:33:52.080,0:33:58.120
get t-shot size to pattern out of my gun
0:33:55.960,0:34:00.639
very well I probably could have I kept
0:33:58.120,0:34:03.480
playing with jokes
0:34:00.639,0:34:06.760
but I I didn't have it was way off it
0:34:03.480,0:34:09.079
wasn't even in the ball I'm same thing I
0:34:06.760,0:34:11.440
I actually tried it as well and I if I
0:34:09.079,0:34:13.599
remember correctly you could get t-shot
0:34:11.440,0:34:15.760
and number four Buck well I couldn't get
0:34:13.599,0:34:18.599
a number four Buck stuff to do worth of
0:34:15.760,0:34:20.760
dang and a t-shot wasn't all that great
0:34:18.599,0:34:22.159
but I bought into it I'm not saying
0:34:20.760,0:34:23.879
there's probably people that got it set
0:34:22.159,0:34:25.639
up right with the right choke common I'm
0:34:23.879,0:34:28.040
sure that's all it was I just needed to
0:34:25.639,0:34:29.200
CH try a different you know a additional
0:34:28.040,0:34:31.599
chokes and I probably could have found
0:34:29.200,0:34:34.960
something worked pretty good uh but man
0:34:31.599,0:34:38.359
I got like two horror stories with dead
0:34:34.960,0:34:40.720
coyote uh did you see the did you see
0:34:38.359,0:34:43.159
the mangi kyota killed a week or so ago
0:34:40.720,0:34:44.359
yeah like a I mean like the filthiest
0:34:43.159,0:34:46.399
nastiest looking thing youever seen in
0:34:44.359,0:34:48.800
your life you know the
0:34:46.399,0:34:50.839
chupacabra well there was a particular
0:34:48.800,0:34:53.679
stand I was actually packing a shotgun
0:34:50.839,0:34:56.079
and a rifle and had my brother filming
0:34:53.679,0:34:58.040
for me and we actually spot coyotes they
0:34:56.079,0:35:00.599
had killed a deer either they either
0:34:58.040,0:35:02.240
killed a deer or found a dead deer
0:35:00.599,0:35:04.240
anyway we spotted them out in this
0:35:02.240,0:35:06.079
pasture field on this deer so we just
0:35:04.240,0:35:08.960
scrambled and got set
0:35:06.079,0:35:11.800
up well what happened is there was like
0:35:08.960,0:35:13.800
three coyotes on it and two of the three
0:35:11.800,0:35:17.480
look like that coyote I just killed I
0:35:13.800,0:35:20.599
mean look like pure 100% zombies I mean
0:35:17.480,0:35:23.359
nasty cows well I let out a how and
0:35:20.599,0:35:26.079
that's all it takes those two nasty mang
0:35:23.359,0:35:28.200
cows here they come I mean coming hard
0:35:26.079,0:35:29.920
so I like whisper over our brother said
0:35:28.200,0:35:31.560
I'm going to shotgun him I just put the
0:35:29.920,0:35:32.800
rifle down the side and had the shotgun
0:35:31.560,0:35:34.480
up cuz I knew we was going to kill them
0:35:32.800,0:35:36.800
at like 20 steps you
0:35:34.480,0:35:39.280
know they caught something they caught
0:35:36.800,0:35:41.440
some movement or picked us off whatever
0:35:39.280,0:35:44.359
happened they they stopped out there at
0:35:41.440,0:35:47.320
60 yards staring a hole through me or
0:35:44.359,0:35:50.000
here I am at that moment thinking well
0:35:47.320,0:35:51.880
do I do I drop the shotgun and try to
0:35:50.000,0:35:53.839
get back on a rifle or do I just go
0:35:51.880,0:35:56.079
ahead and try to shotgun him surely I
0:35:53.839,0:35:59.839
can kill him at 60 yards I got this you
0:35:56.079,0:36:02.839
know bad news stuff dead coyote you know
0:35:59.839,0:36:04.560
I shoot I shoot and those coyotes are
0:36:02.839,0:36:06.440
still running to this day I'm sure Les
0:36:04.560,0:36:09.040
the MS finally killed them the coy got
0:36:06.440,0:36:12.400
away from it 60 yard de Coy stuff got
0:36:09.040,0:36:15.119
away but had another situation very
0:36:12.400,0:36:17.920
similar type thing caught a bobcat up
0:36:15.119,0:36:19.200
and it was like 62 64 yards I remember
0:36:17.920,0:36:21.319
stepping it off I can't remember for
0:36:19.200,0:36:24.280
sure I remember it was 60 plus but same
0:36:21.319,0:36:26.960
type of deal shot I know like two
0:36:24.280,0:36:28.880
pellets hit that cat uh from slowing it
0:36:26.960,0:36:30.680
back down the video but cat got away
0:36:28.880,0:36:32.240
from me jumped like 10 foot in air hit
0:36:30.680,0:36:34.200
the ground flopped around got up took
0:36:32.240,0:36:35.680
off running never did find a cat did it
0:36:34.200,0:36:37.680
kill it I just couldn't find it in the
0:36:35.680,0:36:39.920
brush I don't know but there's two
0:36:37.680,0:36:43.480
instances those are the last two times I
0:36:39.920,0:36:46.119
had packed a shotgun for for years until
0:36:43.480,0:36:47.760
I finally tried this TSS stuff here you
0:36:46.119,0:36:52.040
know over the past you know since last
0:36:47.760,0:36:54.079
year so yeah and and that is going back
0:36:52.040,0:36:56.000
to the to the internet and the post and
0:36:54.079,0:36:57.720
all that stuff because the the shotgun
0:36:56.000,0:37:00.240
post are entertaining to reading
0:36:57.720,0:37:02.880
typically get a pile of comments they do
0:37:00.240,0:37:05.200
they do and you'll you'll see the guys
0:37:02.880,0:37:08.119
that get on there and say that they
0:37:05.200,0:37:09.760
shoot liad whatever they may be talking
0:37:08.119,0:37:11.880
about a lot of them get on there and say
0:37:09.760,0:37:14.319
they're shooting liad turkey loads yeah
0:37:11.880,0:37:16.319
number four number fives stuff like that
0:37:14.319,0:37:19.520
and they'll they will make the claim
0:37:16.319,0:37:20.560
that they will smoke cats at 75 yards or
0:37:19.520,0:37:22.520
they'll put on there that they're
0:37:20.560,0:37:25.280
shooting number four buck and they'll
0:37:22.520,0:37:28.520
smoke them at 80 yards 7080 yards same
0:37:25.280,0:37:31.240
thing with the t-shot and the
0:37:28.520,0:37:33.760
BBS do I think they've killed coow that
0:37:31.240,0:37:35.720
far probably so maybe so do I think
0:37:33.760,0:37:36.680
they've consistently killed coow that
0:37:35.720,0:37:38.599
far
0:37:36.680,0:37:42.200
ABS
0:37:38.599,0:37:44.240
100% there's no question about it that
0:37:42.200,0:37:46.079
they are not killing cows that far I
0:37:44.240,0:37:47.839
don't care what their setup is they are
0:37:46.079,0:37:51.560
not killing cows
0:37:47.839,0:37:53.200
consistently at that range maybe maybe
0:37:51.560,0:37:55.720
maybe they're short-legged and this
0:37:53.200,0:37:58.359
their steps are shorter than your story
0:37:55.720,0:38:00.200
that's exactly what it is it's either
0:37:58.359,0:38:02.200
that or they just outright exaggerating
0:38:00.200,0:38:03.640
which you get a lot with the shotgun
0:38:02.200,0:38:06.079
stuff it would it would be the
0:38:03.640,0:38:08.880
equivalent if if we were talking about
0:38:06.079,0:38:13.000
this and I said that you know if let's
0:38:08.880,0:38:15.680
say tomorrow I kill a c at 140 yards
0:38:13.000,0:38:17.480
with TSS and the only reason that would
0:38:15.680,0:38:19.960
happen is because I threw a hell Mary
0:38:17.480,0:38:22.000
and didn't realize difference could I
0:38:19.960,0:38:24.760
kill one yeah could I kill one at that
0:38:22.000,0:38:26.240
distance because of the penetration sure
0:38:24.760,0:38:28.760
but I wouldn't get online and start
0:38:26.240,0:38:30.640
telling people because of that one Co
0:38:28.760,0:38:32.160
that that I happened to get you know
0:38:30.640,0:38:35.599
they call it the magic
0:38:32.160,0:38:40.280
pellet a magic pellet is not consistent
0:38:35.599,0:38:44.960
so you can't make claims about lead shot
0:38:40.280,0:38:47.319
or any other shot that is not gonna hold
0:38:44.960,0:38:49.200
true over and over and over again and
0:38:47.319,0:38:51.160
that's why I say the effective range of
0:38:49.200,0:38:52.480
that stuff is 40 to 50 yards doesn't
0:38:51.160,0:38:55.599
mean you can't kill one further than
0:38:52.480,0:38:59.319
that but you shouldn't be
0:38:55.599,0:39:01.920
expecting consistent knock the go yeah
0:38:59.319,0:39:05.040
down right there at distances further
0:39:01.920,0:39:08.280
than that with with the lead shot and
0:39:05.040,0:39:10.680
even though I killed you know the TSS
0:39:08.280,0:39:12.440
stuff yeah I think I think it's pretty
0:39:10.680,0:39:16.800
effective at 100 yards like I said it's
0:39:12.440,0:39:19.920
rated for7 yards but I still want that
0:39:16.800,0:39:22.280
80 yards and end for Comfort right you
0:39:19.920,0:39:25.000
know that's just that is a a more
0:39:22.280,0:39:27.920
consistent reliable pull the trigger on
0:39:25.000,0:39:32.240
him and and get the job done
0:39:27.920,0:39:33.720
truthful yeah you know recommendation
0:39:32.240,0:39:35.480
and and I can tell you I can tell you
0:39:33.720,0:39:37.760
another horror story and this goes back
0:39:35.480,0:39:39.319
to regular uh what I can't remember if
0:39:37.760,0:39:41.760
it was Co it was I remember what the
0:39:39.319,0:39:43.640
shot was but I can't remember for sure
0:39:41.760,0:39:46.119
if it was a copper plated lead or what
0:39:43.640,0:39:48.119
but it was this is actually a 10 gauge
0:39:46.119,0:39:49.680
I've got an old Browning 10 gauge that I
0:39:48.119,0:39:51.079
play around with that was passed down
0:39:49.680,0:39:52.839
from my uncle of mine so I always like
0:39:51.079,0:39:55.319
to get it some Field Time whether in the
0:39:52.839,0:39:58.480
turkey Woods or whatever you know Ever
0:39:55.319,0:40:01.480
every few years or so but I had took his
0:39:58.480,0:40:04.640
10 gauge out and I was shooting Federal
0:40:01.480,0:40:07.240
BBS now it wasn't it wasn't a you know
0:40:04.640,0:40:08.839
it wasn't a uh water foul load or
0:40:07.240,0:40:10.319
nothing like that it was a lead shot
0:40:08.839,0:40:11.920
load but whether it was copper plated
0:40:10.319,0:40:13.200
lead or what I don't know I don't even
0:40:11.920,0:40:14.560
think they make this I don't even think
0:40:13.200,0:40:17.359
Federal makes it anymore I Haden been
0:40:14.560,0:40:19.200
able to find it anyway but same thing
0:40:17.359,0:40:22.000
set up on a coyot stand a summer coyot
0:40:19.200,0:40:24.359
stand had Coy located took a rifle and
0:40:22.000,0:40:26.240
that 10 gauge in there and yeah yeah
0:40:24.359,0:40:28.359
packing both of those with that heavy 10
0:40:26.240,0:40:30.280
gauge it was too much to pack I just go
0:40:28.359,0:40:32.119
ahead and tell you right up front but
0:40:30.280,0:40:34.760
got set up there and called the C up I
0:40:32.119,0:40:36.680
mean just like you know just textbook
0:40:34.760,0:40:38.720
you know here comes the thing running up
0:40:36.680,0:40:41.400
a and it gets the inside 70 yards just
0:40:38.720,0:40:43.000
digging same thing I dedicate myself to
0:40:41.400,0:40:44.880
the shotgun just kind of put the rifle
0:40:43.000,0:40:47.079
off to the side put the shotgun on my
0:40:44.880,0:40:50.480
shoulder well guess where he checks up
0:40:47.079,0:40:53.200
and stops after about 55 yards so I well
0:40:50.480,0:40:56.599
I'm packing I got a 10 gauge he's dead
0:40:53.200,0:40:59.200
right right son I I dead centered him
0:40:56.599,0:41:01.319
with that and he flipped and flopped and
0:40:59.200,0:41:04.240
got up took off running I shooked
0:41:01.319,0:41:06.760
another in there boom shot another into
0:41:04.240,0:41:10.040
him he roll gets up again takes off
0:41:06.760,0:41:12.960
running and of course here I am sh shuck
0:41:10.040,0:41:16.319
another in there wow so I've shot three
0:41:12.960,0:41:18.280
shots out of this 10 gauge I'm dazed and
0:41:16.319,0:41:20.040
confused from three shots out of this 10
0:41:18.280,0:41:22.040
gauge the side of my face is hurting
0:41:20.040,0:41:24.560
because the thing is you know rode up
0:41:22.040,0:41:26.720
kicked a fire out of me well that Coy
0:41:24.560,0:41:28.160
makes it to the woods so I look over my
0:41:26.720,0:41:30.359
cousin who was was filming that day I'm
0:41:28.160,0:41:32.160
like I don't know what happened I I
0:41:30.359,0:41:33.880
thought I hit it I should have hit it
0:41:32.160,0:41:36.640
well we watched it back in slow motion
0:41:33.880,0:41:38.960
sure enough the shot pattern the shot
0:41:36.640,0:41:40.880
hit him all three shots and he just
0:41:38.960,0:41:42.160
packed it and went on we went up and
0:41:40.880,0:41:43.440
finally found him in the woods I guess
0:41:42.160,0:41:47.200
that thing had
0:41:43.440,0:41:50.000
run like 120 150 yards after taking
0:41:47.200,0:41:52.119
three shots from a 10 gauge with BB's
0:41:50.000,0:41:54.040
probably the first shot was 50 55 yards
0:41:52.119,0:41:57.000
next shot 60 something and the last shot
0:41:54.040,0:41:57.960
was 70 to 80 yards you know but yeah
0:41:57.000,0:42:02.480
three
0:41:57.960,0:42:04.760
from with BBs he packed it now he fin
0:42:02.480,0:42:07.160
rolled up and died but man he didn't he
0:42:04.760,0:42:08.960
was feeling pretty rough you know he
0:42:07.160,0:42:12.359
just run and it would have been so easy
0:42:08.960,0:42:13.960
to lose it cow and it's not surprising
0:42:12.359,0:42:15.560
and one of the reasons that you know
0:42:13.960,0:42:18.800
when some of these post and stuff come
0:42:15.560,0:42:20.400
up talking about you know the lead shot
0:42:18.800,0:42:22.160
and what they're doing at distance that
0:42:20.400,0:42:23.680
story you just told that's that's
0:42:22.160,0:42:25.559
typical I mean and it's not because
0:42:23.680,0:42:27.240
you're not hitting the cat it's because
0:42:25.559,0:42:30.040
when you hit him it's not doing the
0:42:27.240,0:42:32.119
damage it needs to do and when I first
0:42:30.040,0:42:34.280
started shooting the TSS stuff I was
0:42:32.119,0:42:36.960
still going back and forth I was kind of
0:42:34.280,0:42:39.599
doing some testing so this will kind of
0:42:36.960,0:42:42.200
explain why that happens or why people
0:42:39.599,0:42:43.960
see it happen with lead stuff I seen it
0:42:42.200,0:42:46.200
the exact stuff you just describe I've
0:42:43.960,0:42:48.200
seen that happen several times where you
0:42:46.200,0:42:49.800
got to shoot them multiple times and you
0:42:48.200,0:42:51.520
hammered him with the first shot you
0:42:49.800,0:42:53.760
think it's not pattern density
0:42:51.520,0:42:55.839
necessarily at those ranges it's
0:42:53.760,0:42:58.240
penetration and so what happens what I
0:42:55.839,0:43:01.760
figured out with the with the lead and
0:42:58.240,0:43:03.760
this was on animals and shooting it on
0:43:01.760,0:43:06.160
we've got a big it's kind of like a
0:43:03.760,0:43:10.079
grain being Silo but it's flat sided
0:43:06.160,0:43:12.319
it's not round and it's heavy gauge like
0:43:10.079,0:43:14.400
galvanized metal anyway I use that as a
0:43:12.319,0:43:16.760
back sh back stop when I'm shooting that
0:43:14.400,0:43:19.200
shotgun well over all the years that
0:43:16.760,0:43:21.280
I've shot it where it hits that galvaniz
0:43:19.200,0:43:23.520
you it doesn't do anything to it the
0:43:21.280,0:43:26.040
shot the lead stuff hits flattens out
0:43:23.520,0:43:27.559
and it falls in this it's not a tray
0:43:26.040,0:43:28.880
made to catch it it just just happen to
0:43:27.559,0:43:31.480
work out like that where one of these
0:43:28.880,0:43:33.440
braces on that thing catches a lot of
0:43:31.480,0:43:35.119
the shot yeah well that lead stuff will
0:43:33.440,0:43:37.400
hit it and it flattens out almost like a
0:43:35.119,0:43:40.440
pen on a railroad track type deal yep
0:43:37.400,0:43:41.599
falls down and you know you can see what
0:43:40.440,0:43:44.839
happens to
0:43:41.599,0:43:46.680
it the first time Apex sent me that
0:43:44.839,0:43:48.440
stuff and I shot it I walked up there
0:43:46.680,0:43:49.880
through that thing I couldn't believe it
0:43:48.440,0:43:51.960
part of the pellets none of them shot
0:43:49.880,0:43:54.000
all the way through it but and it's
0:43:51.960,0:43:55.720
heavy gauged up but some of them were
0:43:54.000,0:43:57.400
embedded in the metal to where you would
0:43:55.720,0:43:59.760
had to took a knife or something that
0:43:57.400,0:44:02.079
picked them out uh they were embedded
0:43:59.760,0:44:05.720
that deep in the metal and that PSS is
0:44:02.079,0:44:08.480
still looks exactly like it did when
0:44:05.720,0:44:11.640
does it it's crazy not at all so when I
0:44:08.480,0:44:15.240
started shooting animals with it I skin
0:44:11.640,0:44:17.559
a few of them and I I knew what I'd shot
0:44:15.240,0:44:19.520
a shotgun long enough that there was a
0:44:17.559,0:44:21.440
time when I was skinning some Cs and B
0:44:19.520,0:44:22.720
gu because he worth a little bit well
0:44:21.440,0:44:24.280
you'll skin them and they've been shot
0:44:22.720,0:44:26.680
with number four buck and some of these
0:44:24.280,0:44:28.599
that you've killed you get under the
0:44:26.680,0:44:30.319
high and I'm talking about on the side
0:44:28.599,0:44:33.359
that you shot him on not the opposite
0:44:30.319,0:44:36.240
side you'll get just under the skin and
0:44:33.359,0:44:38.920
you start finding your your number four
0:44:36.240,0:44:41.760
buck and your B all your lead stuff you
0:44:38.920,0:44:44.000
start finding it flattened out under the
0:44:41.760,0:44:45.440
hide or just in the meat and you know
0:44:44.000,0:44:47.280
it's hitting him hard enough to kill him
0:44:45.440,0:44:49.680
and getting some of the pellets are
0:44:47.280,0:44:52.200
getting enough penetration to to get the
0:44:49.680,0:44:53.559
job done but on those that do what
0:44:52.200,0:44:55.200
you're talking about you know you hit
0:44:53.559,0:44:57.319
them knocks them down then they flop
0:44:55.200,0:45:01.079
around they jump up run off you you know
0:44:57.319,0:45:02.480
that type deal is because that lead is
0:45:01.079,0:45:04.000
hitting the animal and it starts
0:45:02.480,0:45:06.079
flattening out and you run out of
0:45:04.000,0:45:09.160
penetration before you get in there and
0:45:06.079,0:45:11.599
get the job done with TSS when you skin
0:45:09.160,0:45:12.800
those same animals shot at the same
0:45:11.599,0:45:15.079
approximate
0:45:12.800,0:45:17.079
distances a lot of times you got a hole
0:45:15.079,0:45:19.800
in and a hole out on the other side and
0:45:17.079,0:45:23.839
if it hits bone or something like that
0:45:19.800,0:45:26.960
it breaks it right you know for the lead
0:45:23.839,0:45:30.800
stuff is steady losing momentum as it
0:45:26.960,0:45:32.319
flattens out and that's the you know
0:45:30.800,0:45:34.359
that's something people a lot of people
0:45:32.319,0:45:36.079
don't know that that's happening but
0:45:34.359,0:45:39.000
that's part of the difference between
0:45:36.079,0:45:39.760
the lead another difference between lead
0:45:39.000,0:45:42.760
and
0:45:39.760,0:45:44.839
TSS that explains some of the stuff that
0:45:42.760,0:45:49.559
you see happen and
0:45:44.839,0:45:51.680
also further further evidence that goes
0:45:49.559,0:45:54.559
against these people that talk about
0:45:51.680,0:45:55.720
these extreme distances with lead right
0:45:54.559,0:45:57.440
you know you're just not going to get
0:45:55.720,0:45:59.400
consistent kills with it so
0:45:57.440,0:46:01.599
you know the going on about it not
0:45:59.400,0:46:03.079
deforming that is that is one thing some
0:46:01.599,0:46:05.800
of these guys that's building these
0:46:03.079,0:46:07.440
custom loads and uh guys that reload or
0:46:05.800,0:46:08.960
load their own shotgun ammunition and
0:46:07.440,0:46:11.040
they're shooting TSS when they're kind
0:46:08.960,0:46:13.960
of testing this stuff just to let
0:46:11.040,0:46:15.480
everybody know you know how how tough
0:46:13.960,0:46:17.839
this stuff actually is they'll actually
0:46:15.480,0:46:19.720
shoot it into a trap and it doesn't
0:46:17.839,0:46:22.000
deform it they'll actually gather that
0:46:19.720,0:46:24.079
shot back up and reload it again into
0:46:22.000,0:46:27.800
another shotgun shell and shoot it
0:46:24.079,0:46:30.559
that's I mean pretty tough wicked stuff
0:46:27.800,0:46:33.280
yeah it's it is it's great and you
0:46:30.559,0:46:35.160
already touched on it but I know it
0:46:33.280,0:46:36.839
sounds like we're just bashing lad I'm
0:46:35.160,0:46:39.720
just trying to explain the difference
0:46:36.839,0:46:41.520
between the two if people if people
0:46:39.720,0:46:43.480
don't want to shoot TSS they can't
0:46:41.520,0:46:44.880
afford it it's absolutely the best stuff
0:46:43.480,0:46:46.359
you can get your hands on but if you
0:46:44.880,0:46:49.599
can't afford it don't want to spend the
0:46:46.359,0:46:52.800
money on it lead stuff will absolutely
0:46:49.599,0:46:56.319
smash coats you just need to know your
0:46:52.800,0:46:59.000
limits with keep keep those shots inside
0:46:56.319,0:47:01.319
40 yard to be on the say 40 to 50 yards
0:46:59.000,0:47:02.920
max and you can shoot lead so if you're
0:47:01.319,0:47:04.720
calling you know if you're confident in
0:47:02.920,0:47:06.440
your calling ability you got you a fox
0:47:04.720,0:47:07.760
Pro and some of them Fox Pro and mfk
0:47:06.440,0:47:10.240
sounds you know you gonna get them in
0:47:07.760,0:47:12.720
you lap then you can shoot that lead
0:47:10.240,0:47:15.960
stuff well it's uh that may have been a
0:47:12.720,0:47:17.720
Flo right there that's right yeah that's
0:47:15.960,0:47:19.440
like we we're not trying to sell
0:47:17.720,0:47:21.319
everybody TSS we'll say it again it
0:47:19.440,0:47:23.160
almost sounds like a TSS infomercial
0:47:21.319,0:47:27.400
here but it's just like what we like to
0:47:23.160,0:47:29.800
use and it's I had swore off shot guns
0:47:27.400,0:47:31.839
you know from those two two of those
0:47:29.800,0:47:34.000
three stories I told you you know one
0:47:31.839,0:47:35.839
was with with the Bobcat That Got Away
0:47:34.000,0:47:38.000
and then those two main youout I mean I
0:47:35.839,0:47:39.720
was just heartbroken you know I was like
0:47:38.000,0:47:41.400
I was mad you know I've had enough of
0:47:39.720,0:47:42.839
this I can't believe I let somebody talk
0:47:41.400,0:47:44.200
me in the back in this shotgun again you
0:47:42.839,0:47:46.000
know throwing it on the ground thinking
0:47:44.200,0:47:48.319
about wrapping it around a tree and I
0:47:46.000,0:47:50.720
swarm them off forever you know for for
0:47:48.319,0:47:54.160
I should say for I swarm off for a long
0:47:50.720,0:47:57.160
time um but here over the last year or
0:47:54.160,0:47:59.440
so I've kind of got to packing them just
0:47:57.160,0:48:01.720
not all the time just on select stands
0:47:59.440,0:48:03.880
and stuff like that but one thing I have
0:48:01.720,0:48:06.079
done this past year I packed this last
0:48:03.880,0:48:07.480
winter is I actually packed a 20 gauge
0:48:06.079,0:48:10.280
and I was want to talk about that a
0:48:07.480,0:48:14.920
little bit let's talk about like the 20s
0:48:10.280,0:48:16.920
12s and 10 um our buddy Greg Gallagher
0:48:14.920,0:48:18.520
he packs a 20 gauge all the time and I
0:48:16.920,0:48:20.440
think he's shooting number fours and
0:48:18.520,0:48:22.440
that's what I was shooting I've tried a
0:48:20.440,0:48:26.200
couple different loads I've tried Apex
0:48:22.440,0:48:28.160
stuff uh Bryce Hensley has foxtrot ammo
0:48:26.200,0:48:31.079
he loads good stuff he has sent me some
0:48:28.160,0:48:32.880
number fours does really good a fellow
0:48:31.079,0:48:36.200
Predator Hunter as well and turkey
0:48:32.880,0:48:39.440
hunter um what what's your thoughts on
0:48:36.200,0:48:40.760
like the the 12 versus 20 versus well
0:48:39.440,0:48:42.160
even though the 10 in there but
0:48:40.760,0:48:44.160
everybody knows the 10's about too dag
0:48:42.160,0:48:47.559
on heavy to pack and it kicks the fire
0:48:44.160,0:48:49.280
out of you so pretty much the 12 and 20
0:48:47.559,0:48:50.960
you what do you think about the 20 I
0:48:49.280,0:48:53.240
know you like the 12 gauge a lot but
0:48:50.960,0:48:55.599
what do you think about the 20 the the
0:48:53.240,0:48:59.240
twelves and the 20s they both got pretty
0:48:55.599,0:49:03.839
popular with turkey and and code hunting
0:48:59.240,0:49:06.599
and to be honest the they're both great
0:49:03.839,0:49:10.200
and I don't even consider 10 gauge stuff
0:49:06.599,0:49:13.200
anymore for One ammo is hard to get
0:49:10.200,0:49:15.319
usually don't yeah they don't and they
0:49:13.200,0:49:18.240
they typically don't outperform a 12
0:49:15.319,0:49:21.839
gauge enough to not much no make the
0:49:18.240,0:49:23.760
make the difference um so yeah just
0:49:21.839,0:49:26.319
sticking with the 12 gauge and 20 gauge
0:49:23.760,0:49:27.280
so I gotta I gotta throw it out there
0:49:26.319,0:49:29.440
this a
0:49:27.280,0:49:31.760
this is a joke I'll start out it is a
0:49:29.440,0:49:35.400
joke but I call Greg if anybody's heard
0:49:31.760,0:49:38.200
it some people I guess my my accent they
0:49:35.400,0:49:39.240
think I'm saying pump gun and he shoots
0:49:38.200,0:49:43.000
an
0:49:39.240,0:49:44.559
automatic I'm saying P I'm saying PP gun
0:49:43.000,0:49:46.079
i' make fun of him for shooting that
0:49:44.559,0:49:48.200
little
0:49:46.079,0:49:50.079
lightweight and where that comes from
0:49:48.200,0:49:52.799
you know back back when we were growing
0:49:50.079,0:49:56.000
up 12 gauge was a man's gun that's what
0:49:52.799,0:49:57.200
you shot when you got grown as a man's
0:49:56.000,0:49:59.920
shotgun
0:49:57.200,0:50:02.680
12 gauge or 10 gauge if he was a grown
0:49:59.920,0:50:05.839
man now them kids and them boys you know
0:50:02.680,0:50:08.599
they started out 20 they might start out
0:50:05.839,0:50:12.119
with a 410 then they progress to a to a
0:50:08.599,0:50:15.760
20 gauge and you know for long they got
0:50:12.119,0:50:18.920
enough muscle and 12 in can't they they
0:50:15.760,0:50:20.359
start toing that man gun so you start
0:50:18.920,0:50:24.200
make me feel pretty good still clinging
0:50:20.359,0:50:26.119
onto this 10 gauge I know so I've always
0:50:24.200,0:50:28.119
called his his 20 I've made fun of some
0:50:26.119,0:50:29.599
of the 20 a Shooters I'm saying why you
0:50:28.119,0:50:31.640
want to go backwards you know why you
0:50:29.599,0:50:34.880
want to go down one of them pup guns a
0:50:31.640,0:50:39.440
boys gun kid gun but the truth is they
0:50:34.880,0:50:43.160
are TSS has made that stuff possible to
0:50:39.440,0:50:46.720
where you can tote a lighter shotgun and
0:50:43.160,0:50:48.920
still get tremendous payload from and
0:50:46.720,0:50:50.920
for some reason the 20 gauge stuff they
0:50:48.920,0:50:52.920
tend to like just about everybody I know
0:50:50.920,0:50:56.440
that shoots a 20 gauge is shooting
0:50:52.920,0:50:59.280
number fours yeah so yeah that's what I
0:50:56.440,0:51:01.119
about out yeah and I have not played
0:50:59.280,0:51:03.680
with the 20 gauge stuff much I did shoot
0:51:01.119,0:51:06.599
and kill a couple CS with Griggs shoots
0:51:03.680,0:51:08.520
great it's devastating uh I'm still
0:51:06.599,0:51:10.359
gonna call it the pup gun I'm still
0:51:08.520,0:51:12.160
gonna give it's got it's got to be
0:51:10.359,0:51:13.559
easier it's got to be easier on your
0:51:12.160,0:51:15.319
shoulder that way you ain't gotta
0:51:13.559,0:51:18.000
worried about having surgery
0:51:15.319,0:51:23.160
again that that's that's right all of
0:51:18.000,0:51:27.680
that is that's true too so either either
0:51:23.160,0:51:30.240
way you want to go on the on the
0:51:27.680,0:51:33.319
20 gauge or 12 gauge but I do think if
0:51:30.240,0:51:36.720
you are I think you need to be I don't
0:51:33.319,0:51:40.680
think if you're GNA shoot a 20 gauge
0:51:36.720,0:51:42.480
shoot TSS yes there this is not a r type
0:51:40.680,0:51:44.359
deal when we were talking while ago I
0:51:42.480,0:51:46.000
was referring do 12 gauge stuff and I
0:51:44.359,0:51:48.480
said you know you can you can do some
0:51:46.000,0:51:50.160
damage with with the lead
0:51:48.480,0:51:54.160
shells I
0:51:50.160,0:51:55.680
still you know well I think it 12 yeah I
0:51:54.160,0:51:57.119
think when it gets to that and you
0:51:55.680,0:51:58.559
should probably fix say didn't mean cut
0:51:57.119,0:52:01.040
you off I I thought you kind of ining
0:51:58.559,0:52:03.839
your s there but one thing is if you try
0:52:01.040,0:52:05.520
to shoot some kind of lead and if it's
0:52:03.839,0:52:07.599
like if you can even find it you'd have
0:52:05.520,0:52:10.640
to get it you know you won't find to
0:52:07.599,0:52:14.079
many Buckshot type loads for 20s your
0:52:10.640,0:52:15.440
your pellet count drops so much you know
0:52:14.079,0:52:17.480
you don't have near the pellets and
0:52:15.440,0:52:20.079
that's a that's a big factor in
0:52:17.480,0:52:22.760
this yeah and that is what I was what I
0:52:20.079,0:52:25.920
was going to repare to that that is with
0:52:22.760,0:52:27.520
a 20 gauge you need to shoot TSS that's
0:52:25.920,0:52:29.559
just all it is to it if you want to want
0:52:27.520,0:52:33.920
a tow to 20 gauge shoot
0:52:29.559,0:52:36.200
TSS um and they're both great that just
0:52:33.920,0:52:37.760
kind of comes down to personal
0:52:36.200,0:52:42.000
preference you know I've always shot a
0:52:37.760,0:52:44.400
12 gauge and I do a little you know you
0:52:42.000,0:52:46.640
do lose pellet count shooting a 20 gauge
0:52:44.400,0:52:49.520
versus a 12 so if you're weigh if you're
0:52:46.640,0:52:52.520
if you're GNA weigh your odds
0:52:49.520,0:52:53.520
on say you're gonna buy a gun you don't
0:52:52.520,0:52:55.359
have one you're gonna get into
0:52:53.520,0:52:57.720
shotgunning then those are some things
0:52:55.359,0:53:00.200
to consider you know do you want oh you
0:52:57.720,0:53:02.440
want to be able to shoot how much how
0:53:00.200,0:53:04.599
much killing power do you want you know
0:53:02.440,0:53:06.240
I kind of looked at it like when TSS
0:53:04.599,0:53:08.760
come
0:53:06.240,0:53:11.040
out I will say the 20 gauges have
0:53:08.760,0:53:14.000
surprised me at how well they performed
0:53:11.040,0:53:16.000
and it does make them a great option but
0:53:14.000,0:53:17.599
when it first when the 20 gaug stuff
0:53:16.000,0:53:19.720
first started catching on with the
0:53:17.599,0:53:21.960
turkey stuff and then the Predator stuff
0:53:19.720,0:53:24.119
I kind of looked at it like like what I
0:53:21.960,0:53:27.640
really did look at it like why are these
0:53:24.119,0:53:30.960
grown men going backwards we finally get
0:53:27.640,0:53:33.200
this stuff that is we get this TSS stuff
0:53:30.960,0:53:37.079
that is just
0:53:33.200,0:53:39.400
unreal and it's smashing turkeys at you
0:53:37.079,0:53:41.960
know 500 yards that's an exaggeration
0:53:39.400,0:53:44.599
but it's smashing these
0:53:41.960,0:53:47.960
turkeys it's a complete I think it's a
0:53:44.599,0:53:50.599
bigger deal for predator hunting uh
0:53:47.960,0:53:54.119
because it outperforms lead if you're
0:53:50.599,0:53:55.760
comparing turkey lead turkey to TSS you
0:53:54.119,0:53:58.200
know the lead stuff works great on
0:53:55.760,0:54:00.119
turkeys you can kill turkeys long ways
0:53:58.200,0:54:01.799
lad it's a bigger difference when you
0:54:00.119,0:54:05.359
start talking about cows because cows
0:54:01.799,0:54:08.880
are so tough um but you know I kind of
0:54:05.359,0:54:11.960
looked at it initially as we get this
0:54:08.880,0:54:14.319
stuff that's so good we can shoot it in
0:54:11.960,0:54:16.760
our 12 gauge and smash all these animals
0:54:14.319,0:54:19.880
with it why in the world would you go
0:54:16.760,0:54:22.839
backwards by downsizing to a 20 gauge
0:54:19.880,0:54:25.599
losing pet count all that kind of stuff
0:54:22.839,0:54:28.280
just to and of course the deal was well
0:54:25.599,0:54:31.280
the guns like you
0:54:28.280,0:54:35.920
know y'all are
0:54:31.280,0:54:38.280
y'all how are y'all men or not but I I
0:54:35.920,0:54:40.319
wish I wish we was recording this and on
0:54:38.280,0:54:42.720
video because I'm like I'm like trying
0:54:40.319,0:54:45.240
to hold back like just like dying laugh
0:54:42.720,0:54:48.079
like I'm choking back tears and laughter
0:54:45.240,0:54:50.520
here because um this is probably going
0:54:48.079,0:54:52.880
to piss some people off right here if
0:54:50.520,0:54:54.240
you have ever watched talk to me much
0:54:52.880,0:54:57.000
especially when it comes turkey season
0:54:54.240,0:54:59.720
comes rolling around and I've we've done
0:54:57.000,0:55:02.559
some videos on our Tik Tok Fox Pro Tik
0:54:59.720,0:55:05.440
Tok page and stuff over the topic I am
0:55:02.559,0:55:08.520
not a fan of a
0:55:05.440,0:55:11.160
410 I think it's the most ridiculous fad
0:55:08.520,0:55:13.119
that's going around and this guys you
0:55:11.160,0:55:14.559
can you can send me all you hate me I
0:55:13.119,0:55:16.559
don't care I'm G to stand on this
0:55:14.559,0:55:18.040
mountain y'all can't push me off of it I
0:55:16.559,0:55:20.200
hate a 410 I'm just going to go ahead
0:55:18.040,0:55:22.119
and admit it and I have actually seen
0:55:20.200,0:55:24.000
some guys loading up some TSS some
0:55:22.119,0:55:26.319
bigger TSS stuff and trying to shoot Coy
0:55:24.000,0:55:28.880
with them and they're killing coyes is
0:55:26.319,0:55:31.400
is a 410 lethal of course it is of
0:55:28.880,0:55:36.160
course it is but we're Tori just talking
0:55:31.400,0:55:38.400
about losing pet count from a 12 to a 20
0:55:36.160,0:55:41.960
well when you drop from like a 20 to a
0:55:38.400,0:55:44.400
410 if if you do the math I think if you
0:55:41.960,0:55:47.200
if you figure this up I think a 410 is
0:55:44.400,0:55:48.480
actually 67 gauge I could be wrong on
0:55:47.200,0:55:51.480
that so y'all double check it but I
0:55:48.480,0:55:54.000
think you're like in a 67 gauge real
0:55:51.480,0:55:56.520
stay away from the dag on 410s let your
0:55:54.000,0:55:58.200
5-year-old shoot you four shoot the 410
0:55:56.520,0:56:01.319
y'all ain't got to take a 4 10 after to
0:55:58.200,0:56:04.799
kill a turkey surely you can pack pack a
0:56:01.319,0:56:07.839
20 or a 12 after in the turkey
0:56:04.799,0:56:09.960
Woods yeah yeah that will ruffle some
0:56:07.839,0:56:11.839
feathers I say all of it pretty much
0:56:09.960,0:56:14.599
joking I don't care what people shoot if
0:56:11.839,0:56:18.680
they if they I don't care with them and
0:56:14.599,0:56:18.680
they they want to tote it you
0:56:19.319,0:56:27.000
know two seasons ago we had the fox Pro
0:56:24.079,0:56:29.440
crew we had a couple guys uh and you
0:56:27.000,0:56:31.359
know they're gonna hear this podcast and
0:56:29.440,0:56:35.119
they're gonna be like dang John he's in
0:56:31.359,0:56:38.000
her butt again but they they packed a
0:56:35.119,0:56:40.799
410 they took a 410 all turkey season
0:56:38.000,0:56:42.880
well guess what we lost a few turkeys
0:56:40.799,0:56:44.799
that that season it was not just past
0:56:42.880,0:56:47.119
season but the season before I think it
0:56:44.799,0:56:50.079
lost like four turkeys guess what four
0:56:47.119,0:56:54.079
turkeys we lost all of them shot at with
0:56:50.079,0:56:57.119
a four10 so surely not I made a rule we
0:56:54.079,0:56:58.960
we always come annual trip to Kentucky
0:56:57.119,0:57:00.880
um the fox Pro crew been coming to
0:56:58.960,0:57:03.000
Kentucky to turkey hunt before I even
0:57:00.880,0:57:04.079
was an employee for Fox Pro they I'd
0:57:03.000,0:57:06.280
invite them down they' come down and
0:57:04.079,0:57:09.119
hunt and they come down and hunt have a
0:57:06.280,0:57:12.079
big trip all that stuff well I I put in
0:57:09.119,0:57:16.720
place a rule for Kentucky turkey hunting
0:57:12.079,0:57:19.559
to come hunt on John's ground no four1
0:57:16.720,0:57:22.039
unless you're under the age of 10 years
0:57:19.559,0:57:24.000
old if you're over 10 years old you're
0:57:22.039,0:57:25.240
packing something bigger than a 41 we
0:57:24.000,0:57:27.039
just ain't having I ain't got time for
0:57:25.240,0:57:29.960
it I ain't got time watch these turkeys
0:57:27.039,0:57:29.960
get crippled and run
0:57:31.319,0:57:36.720
off it's it's fun stuff when they I have
0:57:34.599,0:57:39.880
a lot of fun with it on the you know
0:57:36.720,0:57:42.799
going backwards because it really was
0:57:39.880,0:57:46.680
you know before the TSS stuff made it
0:57:42.799,0:57:48.119
possible to start toting kids guns and
0:57:46.680,0:57:49.960
being effective with them you know it
0:57:48.119,0:57:53.319
kind of turned these kids guns into into
0:57:49.960,0:57:55.200
men they're fun they're fun and I get it
0:57:53.319,0:57:56.920
they're light they're little bitty
0:57:55.200,0:57:59.039
they're easy to pack around
0:57:56.920,0:58:00.480
and they are lethal they are lethal it
0:57:59.039,0:58:02.079
all comes down to me with the pellet
0:58:00.480,0:58:04.160
count you know I just want I just want
0:58:02.079,0:58:06.440
to be able to be able to throw the
0:58:04.160,0:58:07.400
pellets it's you know you know I just
0:58:06.440,0:58:10.400
want
0:58:07.400,0:58:13.039
optimal optimization out of my weapon I
0:58:10.400,0:58:15.640
guess I should say yeah that that's how
0:58:13.039,0:58:18.559
I look at it you know I I kind
0:58:15.640,0:58:21.400
of anyway that's how I've looked at it
0:58:18.559,0:58:24.039
the whole time I will say that the 20 GA
0:58:21.400,0:58:26.599
the 20 gauge versus the 12 is kind of
0:58:24.039,0:58:28.920
like the 12 gauge versus the 10 that I
0:58:26.599,0:58:31.599
started off with because somebody throw
0:58:28.920,0:58:33.200
that as an argument you know me saying
0:58:31.599,0:58:35.520
uh well there's not that much difference
0:58:33.200,0:58:37.960
between the performance of a 12 and a p
0:58:35.520,0:58:42.000
a lot of times a 12 actually outperform
0:58:37.960,0:58:44.359
it the same is is showing to be true
0:58:42.000,0:58:48.520
with the 20 and the 12 even though that
0:58:44.359,0:58:49.799
12 is you know more pellet count and in
0:58:48.520,0:58:52.440
theory
0:58:49.799,0:58:54.079
should slightly outperform and I think
0:58:52.440,0:58:57.520
in a lot of cases it will slight it's
0:58:54.079,0:58:59.400
not enough difference for if a guy's got
0:58:57.520,0:59:03.559
a 20 gauge and he don't want to go buy a
0:58:59.400,0:59:06.599
12 gauge he's he can smoke cows with
0:59:03.559,0:59:08.720
that 20 gauge all day long so it's you
0:59:06.599,0:59:11.000
know the thing with a 10 it's become
0:59:08.720,0:59:13.240
such a dinosaur there's they're hard to
0:59:11.000,0:59:16.160
find there's not many manufacturers that
0:59:13.240,0:59:17.799
produce a 10 anymore choke tubes are not
0:59:16.160,0:59:20.799
the easiest thing to find not every
0:59:17.799,0:59:23.359
choke manufacturer makes 10 gauge chokes
0:59:20.799,0:59:25.559
and if they do the selection is very
0:59:23.359,0:59:26.920
limited they don't do a ton of different
0:59:25.559,0:59:28.760
constriction
0:59:26.920,0:59:30.680
it's hard to find ammo you won't hardly
0:59:28.760,0:59:33.119
find anybody loading ammo for it anymore
0:59:30.680,0:59:36.200
unless it's some kind of waterfoul load
0:59:33.119,0:59:38.640
so the 10 has almost just left the chat
0:59:36.200,0:59:43.000
so to speak it's you know it's become
0:59:38.640,0:59:44.920
almost uh extinct um but I just
0:59:43.000,0:59:46.400
mentioned the water fad type stuff I
0:59:44.920,0:59:48.760
think we need to throw the disclaimer
0:59:46.400,0:59:52.240
out there uh you need to stay away from
0:59:48.760,0:59:53.960
steel shot uh I've seen people ask about
0:59:52.240,0:59:57.799
that but you you talking about asking
0:59:53.960,0:59:59.480
for to do nothing but wound to C that's
0:59:57.799,1:00:01.720
with steel shot they've got to be cuz
0:59:59.480,1:00:04.880
that stuff is light light light stuff a
1:00:01.720,1:00:10.079
that correct to
1:00:04.880,1:00:13.359
7.86 versus I mean versus 18.1 almost
1:00:10.079,1:00:14.640
triple yeah huge difference I mean
1:00:13.359,1:00:18.599
that's
1:00:14.640,1:00:20.520
that's not quite less than half on the
1:00:18.599,1:00:22.720
lead you don't want to shoot it I've
1:00:20.520,1:00:26.240
seen people actually Pro you see it on
1:00:22.720,1:00:29.000
every shotgun thread people promote Ste
1:00:26.240,1:00:31.480
shot no yeah crazy when I see people
1:00:29.000,1:00:33.280
promote steel shot I know what I'm
1:00:31.480,1:00:35.640
dealing with right there and I don't
1:00:33.280,1:00:37.359
listen to I don't pay any attention to
1:00:35.640,1:00:39.359
anything they say about killing cows
1:00:37.359,1:00:41.960
because they're not consistently killing
1:00:39.359,1:00:43.799
cows especially like you said if they're
1:00:41.960,1:00:45.319
killing any if they're consistently
1:00:43.799,1:00:47.000
killing CS they they've got them up
1:00:45.319,1:00:50.799
there
1:00:47.000,1:00:54.480
tight hey please I don't want to lose
1:00:50.799,1:00:58.359
any listeners over me bashing a poor
1:00:54.480,1:01:00.079
10 and and not a bashing uh steel shot
1:00:58.359,1:01:01.480
either just stay away from it that steel
1:01:00.079,1:01:03.520
shot it don't have no place shooting at
1:01:01.480,1:01:05.039
a predator it really don't because you
1:01:03.520,1:01:07.000
it's just you're just going to wound
1:01:05.039,1:01:09.680
them you can you kill them yeah but they
1:01:07.000,1:01:11.359
going to have to be close close close
1:01:09.680,1:01:13.880
it's just better for you save your
1:01:11.359,1:01:16.160
heartache and it's it's better on a cow
1:01:13.880,1:01:17.880
to stay away from the the steel shot
1:01:16.160,1:01:19.480
we've been on here quite a while but I
1:01:17.880,1:01:23.599
still got a couple things I want to ask
1:01:19.480,1:01:25.079
you here Tor to get covered um and I
1:01:23.599,1:01:26.599
think we've covered pretty much
1:01:25.079,1:01:28.720
everything give a lot of lot of
1:01:26.599,1:01:30.319
information and stories and stuff here
1:01:28.720,1:01:31.920
but one question I was want to ask you
1:01:30.319,1:01:35.400
is what's your opinion on packing a
1:01:31.920,1:01:38.319
shotgun and a rifle on the same
1:01:35.400,1:01:41.119
stand I think uh I think that's a good
1:01:38.319,1:01:43.160
idea especially if if your terrain calls
1:01:41.119,1:01:44.599
for it and a lot of times it does you
1:01:43.160,1:01:48.119
know when when I'm out there hunting
1:01:44.599,1:01:50.359
Tennessee with the Clinton Greg you know
1:01:48.119,1:01:52.039
a lot of times walking in we don't
1:01:50.359,1:01:53.760
necessarily know what our setup's going
1:01:52.039,1:01:55.880
to be we may be in the woods and
1:01:53.760,1:01:58.559
everybody's on the shotgun or we may in
1:01:55.880,1:02:00.000
end up on the edge of a cow pasture and
1:01:58.559,1:02:03.200
if you end up on the edge of a cow
1:02:00.000,1:02:04.880
pasture the rifle is is you probably
1:02:03.200,1:02:06.720
need one in your hand or at least
1:02:04.880,1:02:09.599
somebody does so you know if you're
1:02:06.720,1:02:13.599
hunting by yourself and you've got you
1:02:09.599,1:02:15.599
can see potentially see a c farther than
1:02:13.599,1:02:16.680
whatever your effective shotgun range is
1:02:15.599,1:02:18.760
regardless of whether you're shooting
1:02:16.680,1:02:22.039
lead or TSS whatever if you know you
1:02:18.760,1:02:23.720
might have shots farther than that then
1:02:22.039,1:02:26.520
I think it's a good idea to have have
1:02:23.720,1:02:28.640
that rifle on stand yeah I I totally
1:02:26.520,1:02:30.960
agree um you know it's one of those
1:02:28.640,1:02:33.520
deals even if you got the optimal
1:02:30.960,1:02:37.160
shotgun setup where you can kill coyotes
1:02:33.520,1:02:38.960
8090 and 100 yards with your TSS loads
1:02:37.160,1:02:42.000
you know if you've got both and a cow
1:02:38.960,1:02:43.680
tops here at 80 plus you're still better
1:02:42.000,1:02:45.319
off shooting him with a rifle because
1:02:43.680,1:02:47.400
it's still kind of getting in that
1:02:45.319,1:02:49.960
questionable yardage so I I'm right
1:02:47.400,1:02:52.839
there with you only thing and I told
1:02:49.960,1:02:55.440
stories about this I think you the only
1:02:52.839,1:02:57.960
the only two drawbacks with packing both
1:02:55.440,1:03:00.400
in John's opinion is you got to pack
1:02:57.960,1:03:02.079
both it's one extra thing to pack you
1:03:00.400,1:03:04.640
know you're packing two guns so that
1:03:02.079,1:03:07.039
that's a negative but if you're tough
1:03:04.640,1:03:10.559
enough and don't mind it course pack
1:03:07.039,1:03:13.160
both the other thing and I talked about
1:03:10.559,1:03:15.920
this in those stories uh you see an
1:03:13.160,1:03:17.839
animal digging he coming hard you think
1:03:15.920,1:03:21.680
he's going to come real close and so you
1:03:17.839,1:03:23.839
dedicate yourself to the shotgun that
1:03:21.680,1:03:26.200
has got me in trouble in the past with
1:03:23.839,1:03:29.200
shooting you know they still with what
1:03:26.200,1:03:33.119
I'm shooting now those animals are been
1:03:29.200,1:03:34.720
laid out stone cold dead but what I'm
1:03:33.119,1:03:36.799
getting at is if you see one out there
1:03:34.720,1:03:38.440
at 150 yards and he's digging then all a
1:03:36.799,1:03:40.039
sudden you dedicate yourself to the
1:03:38.440,1:03:42.559
shotgun and all a sudden he stops out
1:03:40.039,1:03:44.880
there at 105 and staring a hole through
1:03:42.559,1:03:46.480
you what do you do then do you go and
1:03:44.880,1:03:48.240
try to shoot him with that shotgun or
1:03:46.480,1:03:50.680
you try to reach back over and get your
1:03:48.240,1:03:53.480
rifle that's the that's the negatives
1:03:50.680,1:03:55.480
when it's just one person packing both
1:03:53.480,1:03:56.760
both the rifle and the shotgun but a lot
1:03:55.480,1:03:59.160
of there's a lot of people out there's
1:03:56.760,1:04:02.440
more stealthy than than John Collins is
1:03:59.160,1:04:05.480
as well and can get away with that stuff
1:04:02.440,1:04:09.640
if it were me and I was I was hunting by
1:04:05.480,1:04:11.079
myself and I was proficient with both
1:04:09.640,1:04:12.880
you know I was just as confident
1:04:11.079,1:04:15.319
shooting with my rifle as I was my
1:04:12.880,1:04:18.720
shotgun unless I was just wanting to
1:04:15.319,1:04:22.520
shotgun Cs and then I wouldn't tote both
1:04:18.720,1:04:25.079
if I had setups that were that were
1:04:22.520,1:04:27.599
possibly going to be a rifle shot then I
1:04:25.079,1:04:30.319
would just take the rifle because with
1:04:27.599,1:04:32.880
the rifle you can shoot him right there
1:04:30.319,1:04:34.920
in your lap or as far out as you're
1:04:32.880,1:04:37.680
effective with it and so you only need
1:04:34.920,1:04:39.319
the one that makes more sense as far as
1:04:37.680,1:04:40.760
you know not having to tow as much stuff
1:04:39.319,1:04:42.799
but some people want to get a shotgun
1:04:40.760,1:04:44.960
kill you know stuff like we talked about
1:04:42.799,1:04:46.400
a while ago but it's fun it's fun
1:04:44.960,1:04:47.799
shooting them with a shotgun it really
1:04:46.400,1:04:50.000
is that's kind of what you know kind of
1:04:47.799,1:04:52.279
got me back into it I I like it I mean
1:04:50.000,1:04:54.680
one thing about they kind of they kick
1:04:52.279,1:04:56.760
and they go they go big boom but other
1:04:54.680,1:04:58.319
than that it's fun
1:04:56.760,1:05:01.319
the only other place where I could see
1:04:58.319,1:05:02.880
that you know a reason to do it if you
1:05:01.319,1:05:06.240
were hunting by yourself and you work
1:05:02.880,1:05:07.960
out it would would be if you had two or
1:05:06.240,1:05:10.599
three cows that were hard charging in
1:05:07.960,1:05:12.400
the shotgun might help you get a couple
1:05:10.599,1:05:14.279
of those cows I me kind of that reminds
1:05:12.400,1:05:17.520
me of the stand that last stand with
1:05:14.279,1:05:20.279
with Chris andex come running in Picture
1:05:17.520,1:05:22.440
Perfect textbook get them that's perfect
1:05:20.279,1:05:25.920
for a shotgun style setup but it could
1:05:22.440,1:05:27.839
have Al just as easily been uh a rle
1:05:25.920,1:05:29.520
only stand that those coachs just stuck
1:05:27.839,1:05:33.440
their heads out and stopped right there
1:05:29.520,1:05:35.480
so you know there's there's a little bit
1:05:33.440,1:05:37.839
of that and of
1:05:35.480,1:05:41.480
course my
1:05:37.839,1:05:43.640
situation I'm making dedicated shotgun
1:05:41.480,1:05:46.119
setups every time you know and I think
1:05:43.640,1:05:47.680
that's the thing to do make a make a
1:05:46.119,1:05:51.079
setup with
1:05:47.680,1:05:53.880
whatever weapon best suits that in mind
1:05:51.079,1:05:55.079
from the get-go and that's what I'm typ
1:05:53.880,1:05:57.880
you know that's what I'm pretty much
1:05:55.079,1:06:00.119
always do doing is I know that I'm going
1:05:57.880,1:06:02.279
to if I see the C he's pretty much going
1:06:00.119,1:06:07.039
to be in shotgun range so I don't have a
1:06:02.279,1:06:09.680
rful option 99% of the time so I'm
1:06:07.039,1:06:12.599
strictly I think and that's smart there
1:06:09.680,1:06:14.880
and you know the when I packed a shotgun
1:06:12.599,1:06:16.799
this past winter when I was taking a
1:06:14.880,1:06:19.319
shotgun they were dedicated shotgun
1:06:16.799,1:06:21.119
setups it were tight quarter spots just
1:06:19.319,1:06:23.760
like you was talking about if I see one
1:06:21.119,1:06:26.160
he's in range with a shotgun so I just
1:06:23.760,1:06:27.520
took the shotgun I didn't take both um
1:06:26.160,1:06:30.160
now this summer we've done a little bit
1:06:27.520,1:06:32.119
of it but always had a second Hunter and
1:06:30.160,1:06:34.359
what I would do is I'd pack the shotgun
1:06:32.119,1:06:36.160
and other Hunter to have a rifle is what
1:06:34.359,1:06:37.920
we did yeah but like her buddy Greg
1:06:36.160,1:06:39.839
gallager he'll pack both he'll take
1:06:37.920,1:06:42.359
he'll take his you know his rifle and
1:06:39.839,1:06:44.359
his shotgun and is proficient with both
1:06:42.359,1:06:47.760
and I think he's probably killed
1:06:44.359,1:06:49.559
multiple kot on stand using both weapons
1:06:47.760,1:06:51.599
um so there's definitely there's
1:06:49.559,1:06:53.599
definitely pros and pluses to do it if
1:06:51.599,1:06:54.960
you want to pack it one thing I will say
1:06:53.599,1:06:56.920
and you kind of talked about there just
1:06:54.960,1:06:58.839
a minute ago
1:06:56.920,1:07:00.559
one when I did get away from a shotgun
1:06:58.839,1:07:01.680
and I'd have people send me messages
1:07:00.559,1:07:03.520
about it they'd be like you know why
1:07:01.680,1:07:05.240
don't you use a shotgun or they'd ask me
1:07:03.520,1:07:06.799
questions about shotgun hunting and I'd
1:07:05.240,1:07:08.640
be like you know I'd be like trying to
1:07:06.799,1:07:11.200
take them away from it I'd like hey just
1:07:08.640,1:07:14.039
use your rifle and and one thing I'd
1:07:11.200,1:07:16.880
always tell them was is your a rifle can
1:07:14.039,1:07:18.760
make every shot that a shotgun can make
1:07:16.880,1:07:20.960
but a shotgun can't make every shot that
1:07:18.760,1:07:23.960
a rifle can make if it makes sense to
1:07:20.960,1:07:25.880
you yeah yeah and you know you brought
1:07:23.960,1:07:27.599
Greg up and I'll tell you I funny with
1:07:25.880,1:07:30.920
Greg everybody knows I F with him about
1:07:27.599,1:07:34.599
every year U and I'll tell you why he
1:07:30.920,1:07:37.200
totes both a a lot of times and when I'm
1:07:34.599,1:07:39.160
out there hunting with him and Clint a
1:07:37.200,1:07:41.119
lot of times we pull up to a spot and I
1:07:39.160,1:07:44.039
one of us may say is this shotgun or
1:07:41.119,1:07:46.200
rifle setup yeah sometimes it's a farm
1:07:44.039,1:07:47.920
that hadn't been hunted before that we
1:07:46.200,1:07:49.880
don't know what the setup's gonna be and
1:07:47.920,1:07:51.079
Greg Clint whoever they'll say well
1:07:49.880,1:07:52.839
probably need to take both don't know
1:07:51.079,1:07:54.640
what it's going to look like well we may
1:07:52.839,1:07:58.160
end up set up in a creek bottom or we
1:07:54.640,1:08:00.480
may be out there on a pasture and then
1:07:58.160,1:08:04.839
that's what what you see with Greg a lot
1:08:00.480,1:08:07.839
of times is he is confident with shotgun
1:08:04.839,1:08:10.240
and rifle setups yep so a lot of times
1:08:07.839,1:08:14.599
when he's walking into these Farms to
1:08:10.240,1:08:17.440
hunt he may know that his initial stand
1:08:14.599,1:08:18.920
is going to be a rifle setup yeah and he
1:08:17.440,1:08:21.440
sets up for that but when he starts
1:08:18.920,1:08:22.960
calling all of a sudden these coachs how
1:08:21.440,1:08:27.239
over here in the creek bottom or
1:08:22.960,1:08:31.040
whatever and he ends up changing from a
1:08:27.239,1:08:34.120
a rifle style setup to what would be a
1:08:31.040,1:08:36.239
better shotgun setup so stuff like that
1:08:34.120,1:08:39.120
when you're hunting broken terrain like
1:08:36.239,1:08:41.560
at Middle Tennessee area is that's one
1:08:39.120,1:08:43.359
of the I think that's one of the places
1:08:41.560,1:08:46.239
where you where you have that mixed
1:08:43.359,1:08:48.239
terrain type that would potentially
1:08:46.239,1:08:50.600
benefit tote and both to where you you
1:08:48.239,1:08:52.600
may not know what you're you know you
1:08:50.600,1:08:54.839
may not you may not be able to to say
1:08:52.600,1:08:57.600
this is going to be a dedicated rifle or
1:08:54.839,1:08:59.199
or shotgun gun setup same thing if he
1:08:57.600,1:09:01.679
walks into the creek bottom to begin
1:08:59.199,1:09:04.000
with and then them CS are howling on
1:09:01.679,1:09:05.520
another property across the Pence across
1:09:04.000,1:09:07.239
a big cow pasture but he can hunt the
1:09:05.520,1:09:09.120
cow pasture well he can get out there on
1:09:07.239,1:09:11.679
right edge of cow pasture call him out
1:09:09.120,1:09:14.000
into the edge and shoot those cows with
1:09:11.679,1:09:15.560
his rifle and I think it's just a
1:09:14.000,1:09:19.600
testament to
1:09:15.560,1:09:22.679
Greg good good friend of ours great guy
1:09:19.600,1:09:24.199
uh he's just a terrific cow hunter U I
1:09:22.679,1:09:26.799
think it's just a testament to him how
1:09:24.199,1:09:29.440
well-rounded he is is and you know I'd
1:09:26.799,1:09:33.000
call you know if anybody was ever a ky
1:09:29.440,1:09:34.880
killer it's Greg it just shows how uh he
1:09:33.000,1:09:36.279
can adapt to the situations just like
1:09:34.880,1:09:38.719
you said if he takes both in there and
1:09:36.279,1:09:40.480
he's set up on a on a pasture field and
1:09:38.719,1:09:41.839
the coow get to yipping and hollering or
1:09:40.480,1:09:44.679
over and the thick stuff and he can't
1:09:41.839,1:09:46.480
get them to come out of it all he's got
1:09:44.679,1:09:48.640
to do is go in there and and get that
1:09:46.480,1:09:50.359
that shotgun on his knee and call him up
1:09:48.640,1:09:52.640
to 10 steps and burn them down I mean
1:09:50.359,1:09:54.279
he's just knows how to adapt to whatever
1:09:52.640,1:09:56.159
situation whatever that property is
1:09:54.279,1:09:58.080
throwing at him and gets those D on
1:09:56.159,1:09:58.960
coyotes killed he just a well-rounded
1:09:58.080,1:10:01.600
coyot
1:09:58.960,1:10:05.000
Hunter you see uh you see Joey worth
1:10:01.600,1:10:07.320
doing the same thing Joe exactly exact
1:10:05.000,1:10:09.280
stuff he may be standing there with a
1:10:07.320,1:10:11.520
rifle standing up with a rifle on a
1:10:09.280,1:10:15.600
tripod in the daytime similar to the way
1:10:11.520,1:10:18.080
guys do it at night or he may be in some
1:10:15.600,1:10:21.120
super thick you know just a little strip
1:10:18.080,1:10:24.360
that's running between crop ground so he
1:10:21.120,1:10:26.719
may not tow them both into the stand
1:10:24.360,1:10:28.360
usually because he's got c located but
1:10:26.719,1:10:30.640
he's I bet you he's got them both in the
1:10:28.360,1:10:32.880
truck so that he can pick and choose
1:10:30.640,1:10:34.199
whichever One's best for the for the
1:10:32.880,1:10:36.080
deal but there there's a lot of guys
1:10:34.199,1:10:38.840
that do that and there those are some
1:10:36.080,1:10:40.719
good reasons to do it I got another
1:10:38.840,1:10:42.159
question here that I definitely want to
1:10:40.719,1:10:44.080
get covered before we jump off here
1:10:42.159,1:10:48.920
we've been over here on here for well
1:10:44.080,1:10:51.600
over an hour but um your stand set up um
1:10:48.920,1:10:53.120
yeah eall placement you know got to be
1:10:51.600,1:10:55.040
we've talked about this on a on a
1:10:53.120,1:10:57.320
podcast not too long ago Cory gr talked
1:10:55.040,1:10:59.880
about eall placement stuff when you're
1:10:57.320,1:11:02.880
talking about shotguns it's it's that's
1:10:59.880,1:11:06.400
one it is extremely extremely extremely
1:11:02.880,1:11:08.840
crucial so when you're packing a shotgun
1:11:06.400,1:11:10.480
tell us what you're doing different or
1:11:08.840,1:11:12.040
what you're making sure you're doing
1:11:10.480,1:11:14.960
with your ecall
1:11:12.040,1:11:17.000
placement well I listened to the episode
1:11:14.960,1:11:19.000
that you did with Corey on the the call
1:11:17.000,1:11:21.679
placement which was really good and
1:11:19.000,1:11:23.840
y'all pretty well what y'all explained
1:11:21.679,1:11:26.120
y'all were relating it to the Rival
1:11:23.840,1:11:28.840
setup but what y'all play with call
1:11:26.120,1:11:31.880
placement on your rifle setup is pretty
1:11:28.840,1:11:34.600
much exactly what I do on a shotgun
1:11:31.880,1:11:36.880
setup the only difference is your call
1:11:34.600,1:11:37.880
gets closer to you so you explained you
1:11:36.880,1:11:39.639
know some of the stuff with the
1:11:37.880,1:11:41.520
crosswind setups and where you're
1:11:39.639,1:11:43.600
putting the call you know you're you're
1:11:41.520,1:11:46.040
offsetting that call to one side or the
1:11:43.600,1:11:48.400
other so typically when I go in that's
1:11:46.040,1:11:51.320
the same thing I do with a shotgun setup
1:11:48.400,1:11:54.840
most of the time so when I go into this
1:11:51.320,1:11:57.120
tight stuff I want I prefer a cross wind
1:11:54.840,1:12:00.880
but I either want that wind in my face
1:11:57.120,1:12:03.120
or a cross wind set up and most of the
1:12:00.880,1:12:05.040
time I try to set up some kind of way
1:12:03.120,1:12:07.080
with with the either right to left left
1:12:05.040,1:12:08.920
to right whatever crosswind and I'm
1:12:07.080,1:12:12.440
going to put that
1:12:08.920,1:12:14.600
call visibility is the deciding factor
1:12:12.440,1:12:18.480
like you said on on the deal you I want
1:12:14.600,1:12:20.840
to be able to see that call yeah 99% of
1:12:18.480,1:12:23.400
setups yeah and so typically what I'm
1:12:20.840,1:12:25.560
doing is I'm staging that call out in
1:12:23.400,1:12:27.840
front of me if I can see if it's barly
1:12:25.560,1:12:30.639
open River Bottom stuff and maybe I can
1:12:27.840,1:12:32.280
see you know 75 yards down through there
1:12:30.639,1:12:35.239
well I may get that call on out there in
1:12:32.280,1:12:37.239
that 30 40 yard range just to get it
1:12:35.239,1:12:39.040
away from me I know this is another
1:12:37.239,1:12:40.880
thing about coats and thick stuff where
1:12:39.040,1:12:42.880
you're shotgunning they're pretty
1:12:40.880,1:12:44.280
comfortable in that you know they
1:12:42.880,1:12:45.800
they've got cover so they're pretty
1:12:44.280,1:12:48.280
comfortable getting pretty tight to the
1:12:45.800,1:12:51.840
call but they still want to Circle down
1:12:48.280,1:12:54.239
wind most of the time so I'm visibility
1:12:51.840,1:12:56.840
is dictates where I set it in the more
1:12:54.239,1:13:01.120
open stuff I will get that call out into
1:12:56.840,1:13:03.320
that 30 maybe 40 steps away from me and
1:13:01.120,1:13:07.040
that's about that's usually about the
1:13:03.320,1:13:09.120
max most of the time my typical shotgun
1:13:07.040,1:13:11.440
setup is going to be that call is either
1:13:09.120,1:13:15.920
going to be just a few steps away from
1:13:11.440,1:13:18.120
me out to about 20 25 steps or so that's
1:13:15.920,1:13:21.000
about as far as I'm gon to get with it
1:13:18.120,1:13:23.960
and I'm almost
1:13:21.000,1:13:26.800
always especially even if I don't have a
1:13:23.960,1:13:30.280
crosswind I'm almost always offsetting
1:13:26.800,1:13:32.040
that call to the right or to the left so
1:13:30.280,1:13:34.239
depending on if it's a crosswind I'm
1:13:32.040,1:13:36.199
going to offset the call towards the
1:13:34.239,1:13:38.080
upwind side of where I'm setting so if
1:13:36.199,1:13:41.800
it's left or right I'm gonna walk that
1:13:38.080,1:13:44.679
call out at an angle a pretty hard angle
1:13:41.800,1:13:47.080
to my left and set it down yep and I'm
1:13:44.679,1:13:49.400
anticipating shooting that Co either
1:13:47.080,1:13:50.840
right in front of me or to my right of
1:13:49.400,1:13:52.560
course if he comes straight to the call
1:13:50.840,1:13:55.440
and hard charges and sticks his no you
1:13:52.560,1:13:57.440
still got it still got it yeah so you a
1:13:55.440,1:14:00.719
little offsetting that call just like
1:13:57.440,1:14:02.520
y'all talked about same exact concept
1:14:00.719,1:14:04.159
with the shotgun you're just dealing
1:14:02.520,1:14:06.159
with tighter quarters so you kind of
1:14:04.159,1:14:08.920
suck the call up to you a little more a
1:14:06.159,1:14:11.000
lot of times the only y'all covered this
1:14:08.920,1:14:13.880
on the B you asked I think you asked you
1:14:11.000,1:14:15.400
ever set the call behind you yep and for
1:14:13.880,1:14:17.159
the most part the answer to that
1:14:15.400,1:14:19.440
question was no y'all gave a couple I
1:14:17.159,1:14:23.000
think you gave a an exception to it with
1:14:19.440,1:14:25.400
a particular setup and the exception to
1:14:23.000,1:14:29.120
that with shotgunning is sometimes S I
1:14:25.400,1:14:31.920
run into a spot that is so dang thick
1:14:29.120,1:14:33.960
I'm sitting on a deer trail hopefully a
1:14:31.920,1:14:35.520
fork in a deer trail or intersection
1:14:33.960,1:14:38.159
where I can see two or three directions
1:14:35.520,1:14:41.840
but I may only be able to see 10
1:14:38.159,1:14:44.600
yards yep in that in that
1:14:41.840,1:14:47.239
situation sometimes because I've got
1:14:44.600,1:14:49.800
such tight quarters I really don't have
1:14:47.239,1:14:52.239
if I set the call in front of me the D C
1:14:49.800,1:14:54.520
may hang up before you know he may stop
1:14:52.239,1:14:57.719
before he gets inside right it's th you
1:14:54.520,1:14:59.719
know travel the trail right you pretty
1:14:57.719,1:15:02.360
much know where he's going to pop out so
1:14:59.719,1:15:04.760
in those situations where I just cannot
1:15:02.360,1:15:06.360
see far enough ahead of me to put the
1:15:04.760,1:15:08.880
call in front of me and you got to keep
1:15:06.360,1:15:11.880
in mind every time every time I'm
1:15:08.880,1:15:13.840
setting up I have a pretty good idea of
1:15:11.880,1:15:15.520
I've probably got the Cs located but
1:15:13.840,1:15:17.800
even if I don't I have a pretty good
1:15:15.520,1:15:19.840
idea of where they're going to come from
1:15:17.800,1:15:22.040
and if they don't come from that
1:15:19.840,1:15:24.400
direction my wind has screwed me already
1:15:22.040,1:15:26.040
you especially in tight quarters so
1:15:24.400,1:15:28.159
that's the only time that I will set the
1:15:26.040,1:15:30.320
call behind me and I'm setting it behind
1:15:28.159,1:15:32.960
me to give a little more distance
1:15:30.320,1:15:35.679
between the source of the sound the call
1:15:32.960,1:15:37.840
and where those CS are coming from so
1:15:35.679,1:15:39.760
that hopefully they're closing in on the
1:15:37.840,1:15:43.239
call and when they pop out on one of
1:15:39.760,1:15:44.840
them Trails I've got them where if I set
1:15:43.239,1:15:46.520
the call in front of me I just don't
1:15:44.840,1:15:48.800
have any play they're right on top of
1:15:46.520,1:15:53.000
the call before I can ever even see them
1:15:48.800,1:15:55.159
so that's that's a setup where I will
1:15:53.000,1:15:57.639
you know set the call behind me and and
1:15:55.159,1:16:00.679
then as far as preferred these are a
1:15:57.639,1:16:02.360
couple shotgun and tricks uh that I use
1:16:00.679,1:16:04.239
a lot people see them on the video so
1:16:02.360,1:16:06.320
let's say you you're hunting cow pasture
1:16:04.239,1:16:08.639
stuff but you're wanting a shotgun if I
1:16:06.320,1:16:11.080
can get a wind that's blowing into the
1:16:08.639,1:16:13.480
pasture whatever side that is that I
1:16:11.080,1:16:15.960
will set up pretty much whatever my shot
1:16:13.480,1:16:17.840
40 50 yards something like that I want
1:16:15.960,1:16:19.639
to be able to see the edge and barely
1:16:17.840,1:16:21.280
shoot into the edge of the pasture with
1:16:19.639,1:16:24.520
that wind blowing back out into that
1:16:21.280,1:16:26.920
opening yep and I will set my call on
1:16:24.520,1:16:30.080
the other other side of me y you know up
1:16:26.920,1:16:32.400
wi farther up wi that's a perfect trap
1:16:30.080,1:16:34.719
for shotgun and cods because the Cod has
1:16:32.400,1:16:37.000
a tendency to come down way the col also
1:16:34.719,1:16:38.639
has a tendency to hold cover so where's
1:16:37.000,1:16:40.880
the C gonna come he's gonna come right
1:16:38.639,1:16:43.120
down the edge of that field usually
1:16:40.880,1:16:45.320
inside the tree line with you you can
1:16:43.120,1:16:48.280
kill that Co right in your lap same
1:16:45.320,1:16:51.040
thing with those creek bottom smzs that
1:16:48.280,1:16:52.560
we use the bulk of the time on those
1:16:51.040,1:16:54.600
videos and people that are hunting
1:16:52.560,1:16:57.040
different type terrains you can do this
1:16:54.600,1:16:59.480
with any Edge type it can be a field it
1:16:57.040,1:17:02.480
can be a power line anywhere you're
1:16:59.480,1:17:05.679
dealing with edges you can use this same
1:17:02.480,1:17:09.000
type basically shotgun trap with your
1:17:05.679,1:17:11.239
setup to put those cow in shotgun range
1:17:09.000,1:17:14.520
and use open spots since you don't have
1:17:11.239,1:17:18.400
a rifle you can use those open
1:17:14.520,1:17:21.679
spots as a deterrent yeah for
1:17:18.400,1:17:24.960
yeah you have to them yeah yeah that's
1:17:21.679,1:17:26.760
awesome info great info those Creek
1:17:24.960,1:17:28.199
bottom smz type where you've got a
1:17:26.760,1:17:29.840
Thicket Edge and you've got a creek
1:17:28.199,1:17:32.639
bottom that's a little bit more open and
1:17:29.840,1:17:33.960
you've got a cross wind you can sit down
1:17:32.639,1:17:35.719
right in the middle of that and those
1:17:33.960,1:17:37.920
smzs you know you can usually shoot to
1:17:35.719,1:17:39.159
both sides they may be 50 60 yards wide
1:17:37.920,1:17:40.760
so if you're sitting right in the middle
1:17:39.159,1:17:43.280
of it with a cross wi let's say it's
1:17:40.760,1:17:45.600
right to left I'm G to set my call over
1:17:43.280,1:17:48.520
towards that right edge of the creek
1:17:45.600,1:17:50.960
bottom out in front of me and even if
1:17:48.520,1:17:54.199
I've got the couch located on the right
1:17:50.960,1:17:55.800
hand side down the creek I'm gonna be
1:17:54.199,1:17:57.560
watching this left hand side of the
1:17:55.800,1:18:00.960
creek because what that coat will
1:17:57.560,1:18:03.040
typically do is he's going to come in
1:18:00.960,1:18:04.719
he's going to hit the edge on the
1:18:03.040,1:18:06.280
leftand side now sometimes they're just
1:18:04.719,1:18:07.719
hard charged go and those are the easy
1:18:06.280,1:18:10.040
ones but the ones that are doing the
1:18:07.719,1:18:12.679
wind trick they will come and they will
1:18:10.040,1:18:14.800
hit that edge and they'll run that edge
1:18:12.679,1:18:16.600
right to you and you can kill them down
1:18:14.800,1:18:18.120
way into the call before they ever get
1:18:16.600,1:18:20.600
to you and they're right in your lap
1:18:18.120,1:18:23.040
with a shotgun and that's that is the
1:18:20.600,1:18:26.360
people that watch the videos that is the
1:18:23.040,1:18:27.960
setup that they see it's hard to tell
1:18:26.360,1:18:30.199
that on video because you don't have
1:18:27.960,1:18:31.560
enough pay to show that whole deal right
1:18:30.199,1:18:33.679
but that's what's that's what's
1:18:31.560,1:18:36.239
happening those are the the Hunts that
1:18:33.679,1:18:39.400
they're watching why the shotgun stuff
1:18:36.239,1:18:41.280
works so well yeah it's great great glad
1:18:39.400,1:18:43.199
you shared that that that's that's the
1:18:41.280,1:18:46.199
Golden Nugget on this episode right
1:18:43.199,1:18:47.760
there I love it awesome stuff well we've
1:18:46.199,1:18:51.480
been on here quite a while you got
1:18:47.760,1:18:54.280
anything you want to leave these uh um
1:18:51.480,1:18:56.159
hunters and ladies and gentlemen and
1:18:54.280,1:18:58.199
whoever El listens this podcast what you
1:18:56.159,1:18:59.800
want to leave them with here Tor we
1:18:58.199,1:19:02.480
wouldn't be but 10 minutes deep if you
1:18:59.800,1:19:06.159
had have got on them four10 oh my gosh
1:19:02.480,1:19:08.360
oh my gosh yeah hey just just the usual
1:19:06.159,1:19:11.480
appreciate everybody listening using Fox
1:19:08.360,1:19:13.080
Pro mfk and hope y'all uh love getting
1:19:11.480,1:19:14.760
the messages and seeing the post where
1:19:13.080,1:19:17.600
y'all are having success after listening
1:19:14.760,1:19:20.600
to this stuff so like uh like hearing
1:19:17.600,1:19:22.760
that and appreciate y'all yep yep same
1:19:20.600,1:19:24.760
same here actually saw I seen you
1:19:22.760,1:19:27.239
commented on earlier there was a guy was
1:19:24.760,1:19:29.159
ask you know hey does there is there any
1:19:27.239,1:19:31.280
podcast out there that that could help
1:19:29.159,1:19:34.199
me out for this time of year uh you know
1:19:31.280,1:19:36.120
and I rattled off you know four five six
1:19:34.199,1:19:39.480
episodes It's kind of pertains this time
1:19:36.120,1:19:41.679
of year uh for for Colin coyot but I was
1:19:39.480,1:19:43.880
W to tell him go back and listen to all
1:19:41.679,1:19:46.120
of them every single podcast we put out
1:19:43.880,1:19:49.840
you know we we tons of them on here with
1:19:46.120,1:19:51.600
Tor Big Al Morris uh you know some of
1:19:49.840,1:19:53.120
the best Coy Hunters all across the
1:19:51.600,1:19:55.719
country there's there's little golden
1:19:53.120,1:19:58.760
nuggets like what Tor just told there
1:19:55.719,1:20:00.199
just a minute on his shotgun setups uh
1:19:58.760,1:20:01.719
to take away from every one of these
1:20:00.199,1:20:04.400
episodes so just appreciate everybody
1:20:01.719,1:20:06.040
that listens um if you if you listen
1:20:04.400,1:20:08.040
this is the first one you listen to
1:20:06.040,1:20:11.040
we've got so many great topics with so
1:20:08.040,1:20:12.840
many great coyot callers surely it's a
1:20:11.040,1:20:14.760
little entertaining and I guarantee
1:20:12.840,1:20:16.840
you'll learn something along the way
1:20:14.760,1:20:18.920
from somebody from one of these episodes
1:20:16.840,1:20:20.800
but we really appreciate you appreciate
1:20:18.920,1:20:22.719
you following along with us we hope you
1:20:20.800,1:20:26.639
enjoyed this episode we hope you join us
1:20:22.719,1:20:26.639
again here on the fox Pro podcast